[quote=“Rhodri, post:781, topic:2160”].905 Rifle
Due to only 3 ever being made, you’d have to craft the rifle and ammunition yourself, with the recipe probably being found in a skillbook.[/quote]
Don’t we have an elephant gun that not only fits that roll but makes sense to find one in a manor, next to the suit of armour and the stuffed bear.
And what rubbish are they going on about, .905 is not the biggest by a long way, it has nothing on the old 2 bore big-game guns, there 1.326 inches
[quote=“Funk, post:801, topic:2160”][quote=“Rhodri, post:781, topic:2160”].905 Rifle
Due to only 3 ever being made, you’d have to craft the rifle and ammunition yourself, with the recipe probably being found in a skillbook.[/quote]
Don’t we have an elephant gun that not only fits that roll but makes sense to find one in a manor, next to the suit of armour and the stuffed bear.
And what rubbish are they going on about, .905 is not the biggest by a long way, it has nothing on the old 2 bore big-game guns, there 1.326 inches[/quote]
pretty sure thats a typo, think its supposed to be .950 but. 1.+ is definitely still bigger.
[quote=“Funk, post:801, topic:2160”]And what rubbish are they going on about, .905 is not the biggest by a long way, it has nothing on the old 2 bore big-game guns, there 1.326 inches[/quote]They said it was the largest center-fire rifle + cartridge produced. Said 2-bore big-game guns were muzzle-loaded black-powder weapons AFAIK.
Anyways, it’s still bloody ridiculous. It’s basically a disembodied tank cannon you’re carrying in that rifle. Each individual round today costs $40, and there’s only 3 of those guns in existence, to say nothing about how rare they would be after the Scheiße hits the fan.
Once easier IUSE comes around, im making a switch-hammer.
Make it require 5 springs, 2 sledges, 2 battleaxes, a zwei, 12 pipes, and 4 spiked plating.
Heavy cost, I know.
Im not sure if this is possible, but i think it’s a neat idea.
The gimmick:
Unactivated, it’s a switch-hammer. This provides around 45~ bash, cumbersome weight, something like that.
Slow, brutal, wide attack
Activated, once reloaded with a ton of batteries, will be the switch-axe(original idea do not steal)
50~ cut. Each hit costs 5/50/100 batteries depending on how much batteries i make the thing hold.
Precise, quick, wide attack
“A state-of-the-art weapon using a heavily modified battle axe made into a zweihander, and two sledge hammers combined into one. It uses a new active mode offensive system to provide situational bash and cut attack. When used in skillful hands, it is a very, very powerful weapon.”
OP? Yep.
Awesome? Yep.
Totally not inspired by Monster Hunter switchaxes nope not at all
[quote=“nomzynomnom, post:804, topic:2160”]Once easier IUSE comes around, im making a switch-hammer.
Make it require 5 springs, 2 sledges, 2 battleaxes, a zwei, 12 pipes, and 4 spiked plating.
Heavy cost, I know.
Im not sure if this is possible, but i think it’s a neat idea.
The gimmick:
Unactivated, it’s a switch-hammer. This provides around 45~ bash, cumbersome weight, something like that.
Slow, brutal, wide attack
Activated, once reloaded with a ton of batteries, will be the switch-axe(original idea do not steal)
50~ cut. Each hit costs 5/50/100 batteries depending on how much batteries i make the thing hold.
Precise, quick, wide attack
“A state-of-the-art weapon using a heavily modified battle axe made into a zweihander, and two sledge hammers combined into one. It uses a new active mode offensive system to provide situational bash and cut attack. When used in skillful hands, it is a very, very powerful weapon.”
OP? Yep.
Awesome? Yep.
Totally not inspired by Monster Hunter switchaxes nope not at all[/quote]
Reminds me of D&D’s Rod of Lordly Might. Multiweapons are Nifty but, as you anticipate, this is not gonna make it into mainline.
[quote=“troll from behind, post:798, topic:2160”]Chain-and powerweapons!
Granted, way too much warhammer 40000, but in the not-so-distant future there ought to be some countermeasures to power armours.
Chainswords and -axes though…Who wouldn’t want one of those noisy, messy and prone of getting stuck in zeds head piece of ultimate argumentors?[/quote]
I totally need to learn how2code to mod in some WH40K weapons in my game. Chainaxes, Thunder Hammers, Power Fists, Power Claws.
Wait… isnt this already a chainsword?
Lots of these might be in the game already. I don’t often get much past the scrap crowbar phase.
TL;DR: Thermite, explosive .45 shells, more CZ pistols, less silenced guns without proper ammo.
Guns:
[spoiler]
Common guns: Where I live, you can find at least one of these in pretty much any gunowning household. I live in Canada, so it’s pretty easy to assume the “you can buy nukes over the counter” world of C:DDA would also contain these, what with the more progressive gun laws and all. Most of them are old right now, let alone in the future, but they are still in very common use around here because it’s pretty hard to straight up wear a gun out. The argument that they are out of place in a world with plasma rifles holds little water with me, because I’ve noticed most people who own guns tend to hang on to the ones that work, even if they are a little obsolete.
-Lee-Enfield No. 4 Mk.1 (The longest issued bolt action rifle in existence, and if you want to count the rest of the Enfield lineage (though most are unrelated blackpowder designs), the statement could be made that these sorts of rifles are a big factor in the fact that we are speaking English right now. Still issued here and in other places in .303, though .308 models are made these days and might be more convenient ammo-wise. For the lulz, could be made as a No.1 Mk.III*, which is an older version that can attach a 16 inch (!) sword bayonet. Unlike the mosin, which is in game, these guns can be repaired using parts off other enfields of the same version without any gunsmithing)
-Cooey Model 84 (single shot shotty of various gauges, particularly useful if Molotov launchers seem like a good idea - see below)
-Cooey Model 60 (.22 bolt action that can be fixed with many parts not intended for it)
-Smith and Wesson M&P Victory Model Revolver (Couple million of these things made during the second world war. The .38 special edition, because .38 S&W is hard to find right now, let alone in the future.)
-Winchester 94AE (I’m sure this must already be in the game and I just haven’t found one yet. I mean, it’s THE .30-30)
-Winchester Model 92/1873 (I think most gun guys will tell you the '73 is the nicer gun, but a 92 is much more likely to survive the apocalypse. Game needs more pistol caliber rifles and these are built in modern calibres like .44 and .357)
Uncommon Guns: A serious gun guy will probably have some of these, but they aren’t EVERYWHERE.
-Bren Gun (while a machinegun from the 1930s is not really a common thing to find in working shape, these were issued well past the time you’d expect them to be, tons were made, and lots of deactivated models that could be brought back into service with a lot of time and effort are out there. Besides, IT’S ME BREN GUN!)
-Savage Model 42 (though found in lots of different calibres, the top barrel is usually .22, bottom barrel is .410 or 20 gauge. You can fix these guns with everything from rubberbands to pen parts quite safely)
-More blackpowder stuff (sure, your fancy MP5K can spit 800 rounds a minute, but I can make ammo for one of these with things I can find laying around my house. Seems like BP would make a comeback in the apocalypse for more or less the same reasons it hung around for the last 400 years. Singleshot-ness and relatively low ft-lbs of energy can be offset by a bayonet or something)
-CZ 97 (the 1911 is a great gun. The 97 does an even better job of being a badass .45 though)
-FN FAL (either semi- or fully- auto, who cares? While the U.S. was issuing M-14s and then M-16s, literally the rest of the western world was running the FN. These are so common outside of the U.S. that despite being very illegal in most countries that issued them, they can still easily be found. Less common, but still present in the U.S.)
-Makarov pistol (like Mosins and SKS’ and AKs, this sort of Russian junk can be found everywhere)
-Browning Buckmark (the only .22 semi pistol I’ve owned that just works, period. Pretty common, at least as much as a Ruger MK III. They also make a rifle version that takes the same mags)
-Smith and Wesson model 1917 (though the gun is common, the variant that can go between shooting .45 Colt and .45 ACP is not, but would make a reasonably sensible survival gun)
-Tricked out Ruger 10/22s (I’m sure the 10/22 is already in the game. If it is, we need tricked out versions, because no one just leaves them in the wood stocks anymore. Tactical styles with flashhiders and bayonets and 100 round drums jump to mind, but there some really cool kits to make them look like everything from a tommygun to a blaster rifle. Even if it’s just flavor text, would be cool)
Rare Guns: Because it’s one thing to survive the apocalypse, it’s another to do it wielding a collectable.
-Radom Pistol (because it’s about the only non-CZ gun I’ve ever owned that I’d trust through the end of civilization)
-Webley Mk. V or Enfield Revolver (guns are common, ammo is rare. Neither shoot worth anything, but the bullet is nice and big)
-Walther P38 (Nazi 9mm. Something cool about wielding megatron, and the alloy frame P1 version is actually really common)
-Mauser C96 (Imperial German 9mm. Also Han Solo’s blaster)
-MG34 (8mm machine gun. You can actually buy semi conversions off the shelf here for about $3000, though they are kinda pointless schwanzgewehers)
-BRNO pellet guns (shoot a lighter bullet at about the same speed as a standard velocity .22)
-Something chambered in .300 AAC/.300 Whisper (while these guns seem pointless for a civvy in real life, being able to go from sonic to subsonic ammo (i.e. loud to nearly noiseless) would actually be a huge advantage in the apocalypse. Especially because you can make these out of very common .223 brass)
Special ammo types (and a few other things):
[spoiler]I haven’t actually seen anything like this in game so far, but it seems like the crafting system is well designed and implementation wouldn’t be impossible.
Other things:
-Fully auto conversions (Most semi-automatics can be converted to fully automatic with a couple minutes and a file once you understand how they work. The downside to this is that semi-autos aren’t really MEANT to shoot like that, and usually wear out within a couple hundred rounds, not to mention that’s it’s highly illegal pretty much everywhere IRL. Though it’s arguably not a big advantage to do this in-game (or real life, frankly), it’s a realism thing. It’s also worth noting that this could even be an unintended side effect of poor firearms maintenance in relation to certain guns - for example, if you completely disassemble certain models of SKS and don’t put them back together the right way, or do not know how to clean them, they can occasionally “slam fire” the whole magazine off when you drop the bolt. Though the mental image of your brave survivor’s rifle accidentally discharging it’s whole mag into the shelter wall as you prepare to go out and fight some monsters is funny, delaying this until you actually pull the trigger would induce a better “oh shat” moment. I know a little bit about guns, so if there was any interest in this, I’d be happy to poke through a list of guns already in game that would either have this as an issue, or be capable of conversion. Given that the trigger happy trait sort of does this in some ways, it doesn’t seem infeasibly hard to add)
-Thermite (like the easiest thing to make ever - aluminum fillings and rust is all you need, though you can add other stuff to make a sticky paste out of it, and magnesium to make it easier to ignite. It’s harder to ignite than to construct. Would be handy for burning through walls (or really anything) with less noise than an explosive, though it wouldn’t be too useful as a weapon. You can actually make quite a few friction activated explosives using aluminum powder too, but there’s already enough boom in the game, so it’s not really worth mentioning)
-Gauss weaponry (while a portable gauss rifle is pretty much impossible to build (or at least pointlessly resource costly in the case of modern militaries who have the resources to attempt it), something more stationary that is actually capable of causing harm is surprisingly easy to build right now, and would likely be quite feasible for a very knowledgeable survivor in the future to make. Would require some very rare superconductive magnets (gold-based magnets, such as those you can use in a ball-bearing “gauss” launcher wouldn’t suffice - you’d need some heavy duty stuff here) as well as capacitors, strong non-conductive materials, a pile of wiring and some method of generation some really serious amounts of electricity, but could make for a neat anti-horde trap, what with being able to shoot through many objects at once and all. For balance (and realism, since the little bearing launchers I’ve built in the past have always had to be reset after each shot), make it a single shot affair that requires maintenance between firings).
-Beer can mortars (granted, I’ve never launched anything out of one besides beercans full of cement, but this are so simple to make it’s painful and should be adaptable to explosives. Alternatively, you can make a somewhat unsafe Molotov launcher using broomhandles, 12 gauge shells, and a single shot shotgun. If you do it right, you can throw fire around 100 yards. If you do it wrong, the Molotov breaks and f**ks your day up.)
-What can and can’t be “silenced” needs a tweak. Suppressors work by capturing the gasses that follow the bullet out of the barrel, reducing the noise. If the bullet is supersonic, then it’s still pretty much as loud as it was before because of the sonic boom. .223 seems to be an exception to this due to some sort of internal ballistics I frankly don’t completely understand, and can be made pretty quiet despite going 3100 FPS. Obviously, there is a gameplay element here, but still. I can supply of list of what should and shouldn’t be suppressable if anyone is interested.[/spoiler]
.950 JDJ actually costs something like $150 per shot right now, not including the price of renting the rifle out. The current gun also weighs something like 110 pounds and still doesn’t look at all fun to shoot (something like 250 ft-lbs of recoil AFTER counting the brake, which even out of 110 lbs gun means you have about 100 lbs put into your shoulder). Might actually be cheaper to get ammo after the world ends, because it’s made from 20mm (or 30, too late to remember) shells, which I think are in game already(?). Contrary to what the article quoted says, the BATF doesn’t actually list this as a destructive device, so if SSK is still around after the world ends, and you have god-amounts of money, they can build you one without you having to worry about whether or not the feds will kick your door down for not having a tax stamp. Couldn’t find the recipe in a skill book because J.D. likes to keep all of his cool stuff proprietary and will sue you despite the world having ended*. 2-bores are nominally bigger (as with punt guns and stuff like that), but produce significantly less muzzle energy (something like 38,000 ft-lbs, very similar to dropping a sedan on something) than that monster, just like anything outside of a proper artillery piece. So not actually more powerful, just diametrically larger. If that’s what you fellas are talking about anyway.**
*Kudos if anyone gets that joke, apologies to Mr. Jones if he somehow lurks these forums.
**Sources: Cartridges of the World 13th Edition, and a professional relationship with the SSK guys.
I’m sure this has been mentioned before, but I don’t know for sure…
I’ve never seen mace, pepper spray, or a taser in the game. Would they do much to zombies? Probably not…but they should still make it in at some point. Likewise, there should be stuff (rarely, but in decent quantities where it spawns) like tear-gas, gas grenades, and the like at SWAT-ish locations.
[quote=“secretfire, post:808, topic:2160”]I’m sure this has been mentioned before, but I don’t know for sure…
I’ve never seen mace, pepper spray, or a taser in the game. Would they do much to zombies? Probably not…but they should still make it in at some point. Likewise, there should be stuff (rarely, but in decent quantities where it spawns) like tear-gas, gas grenades, and the like at SWAT-ish locations.[/quote]
tasters are very much in the game already. Some starts even come with one.
[quote=“Litppunk, post:809, topic:2160”][quote=“secretfire, post:808, topic:2160”]I’m sure this has been mentioned before, but I don’t know for sure…
I’ve never seen mace, pepper spray, or a taser in the game. Would they do much to zombies? Probably not…but they should still make it in at some point. Likewise, there should be stuff (rarely, but in decent quantities where it spawns) like tear-gas, gas grenades, and the like at SWAT-ish locations.[/quote]
tasters are very much in the game already. Some starts even come with one.[/quote]
I want a taster. You know, because i lost my tongue. Ok sarcastic lameness apart, that was fun. d:
I want more useless things like lamps and photos and plants and more stuff like that to spawn in houses to make them more real and also to be able to use them in a desperate attempt, like in movies.
[quote=“ApatheticExcuse, post:807, topic:2160”]- 12 gauge battery loads (I’m of the opinion that a battery has some pretty godawful ballistics and would never be as good as a proper shell. That said, when all you have is hulls, primers, powder, and dead batteries, it’s sure more effective than angry words)[/quote]This video might interest you. The fact that they used pumpkins might be a pretty good indicator of what they might do to a zombie’s body.
Also, .22 CB has been in the game for as long as I can remember playing it; this has pissed me off to no end when I find hundreds of rounds of CB and absolutely zero regular .22 LR.
If you really wanted to, you could have all the Warhammer weapons you want and put them in a total conversion mod. Have a botched landing leave marine and guardsman forces scattered across the planet. Reanimating Necron zeds, Ork fungus, Triffanids, (Dark)Eldar appearing randomly around waygates and making unintelligible demands, Tau colonies, Chaos-infested swamps, random guardsmen and marines roaming around, some of them willing to spare a moment from the battle for the world to purge you of your heresy… If all the people who wanted W.H. stuff got together, maybe they could make something happen…
[quote=“BadSniper, post:811, topic:2160”][quote=“ApatheticExcuse, post:807, topic:2160”]- 12 gauge battery loads (I’m of the opinion that a battery has some pretty godawful ballistics and would never be as good as a proper shell. That said, when all you have is hulls, primers, powder, and dead batteries, it’s sure more effective than angry words)[/quote]This video might interest you. The fact that they used pumpkins might be a pretty good indicator of what they might do to a zombie’s body.
Also, .22 CB has been in the game for as long as I can remember playing it; this has pissed me off to no end when I find hundreds of rounds of CB and absolutely zero regular .22 LR.[/quote]
I’ve seen that vid, actually. The issue there is that they are shooting it from a very close distance, and still get abysmal accuracy out of it - it’s hard to say exactly where he’s aiming, but I don’t think it’s for the lower corner of the plate. Also, a battery does not have the weight or energy of a proper slug (which will pulp a pumpkin), or the advantage of spreading like shot (though the energy is probably similar). The other issue (if you want to call it that) is that the playdoh is almost as effective, as is everything they fire that doesn’t require proper wadding behind it (i.e. anything that comes out as a reasonably solid projectile). Shooting the steel is misleading because it’s very different than a soft target - I might have missed it, but I’m pretty sure that’s all they shoot with the batteries in this vid. If they do shoot a pumpkin, then I suspect it would be pretty easy to see what I’m talking about. I stick to my guns (lulz), it’s a lousy projectile compared to proper ammo, but better than nothing. To me this speaks more to the versatility of shotguns than to the effectiveness of batteries in particular.
Didn’t realize CBs were in, like I say, I don’t get much past the first few days right now. Can they chamber in a standard, non-semi .22?
| | |
.22 CB .22 Short .22 Long Rifle
Probably not.
| | |
.22 CB .22 Short .22 Long Rifle
Probably not.[/quote]
huh pipe fed marlin 10/22 can use most any .22 round and is short stroke lever action… but I doubt it would properly handle a round that small… not to mention it seems like it does very little damage even compared to other .22s
Although this reminds me of something. Larger, faster rounds with greater energy transferred to target should cause extra damage to living entities in the form of cavitation. Nothing better to remind you the destructive power of firearms than bullet in the thigh that makes the heart falter. maybe also make this a potential medical problem… “your guts feel awful, maybe the shock from that ____ had more lasting effects than initially believed.”
To clarify, I know in RL they can, though it can cause a ring of carbon to build up in the chamber at the end of the casing to the point where chambering proper .22 LR can actually be a problem - many levers are somewhat immune to this (dependent on the specific model, marlin 39A is a good example) due to the way the action locks up, but it is a problem you see often in bolt actions and semis (savage mk IIs and ruger 10/22s are good examples). Getting that ring back out generally requires time on a lathe. Same problem can also occur in reverse with super high velocity .22 LRs, which actually use a slightly longer case than standard - you will sometimes run into a gun that will not chamber because regular .22 LRs have built up a ring that disagrees with the extra length on say, a CCI Stinger.
CBs might not be very effective in terms of RL (or ingame) damage, but they have the advantage of being nearly silent (IRL). This is because they are simply a bullet on top of a primer with no powder charge, and only run at something like 400FPS IIRC - well below the speed needed to make a sonic boom. They don’t usually shoot particularly well as bullet stabilization is dependant on both speed and bullet weight - while they might be pushing a 40gr projectile (which is a fairly standard .22 LR weight), they are doing it at roughly a third the speed of standard .22 LR, and most "CB"s are even worse for this - they are actually .22 LRs with a reduced charge and much heavier (60gr-ish) bullet on top of them. While older guns (i.e. from the era where people would commonly use CBs, Shorts, and Longs as well as Long Rifles) are are sometimes set up using a “compromise” twist rate of something like 1:12, most modern .22s are geared more for .22 LR and have a twist of 1:16, meaning heavier or slower bullets (the two common ways to make a subsonic .22 round) will not be stabilized properly and thusly not particularly accurate. You can also run into freebore (how much distance the bullet traves before engaging the rifling) and engraving issues (how the bullet engages the rifling) in longer barrels, though that seems like something that would not be worth reflecting in game as it is rarely a RL problem.
I am a professional gunsmith IRL (albeit an apprentice with more sales experience than smithing experience, and I spend more time trying to maintain a budget wordpress site with my virtually non-existant HTML skillz than working on guns recently) and feel pretty confident in my real-world gun knowledge, so my question pertains to in game rather than RL. Do they chamber in a .22 LR in C:DDA? If not, then I’d suggest they should, since no one has made a .22 rifle that doesn’t chamber the whole CB/S/L/LR progression in at least 70 years, and those that don’t still chamber CBs and shorts. I’m unaware of any rifle ever being built to chamber JUST CBs (though I think a couple “parlor pistol” type guns from the 1800s may have been), so it makes little sense to have them as a “separate” ammo type in the sense that they require a CB chambered gun.
If they are that common, I’d suggest they also be made less common. I know of two companies making a proper CB now, but at least a dozen making LR - it is by far far far the more common RL ammo.
Though opinions are kinda divided on whether or not hydrostatic shock (temporary cavitation) makes much difference in terms of lethality (I personally think it does based on having shot a few bears with both a .300 WSM with barnes TTSXs (which are high velocity and expand, and should cause H.S.) and both swift a-frames and barnes solids using a .375 H&H (which are made to penetrate rather than go fast and open up)), there’s no denying that it does seem like it would be a hell of a lot more painful to be hit by something that causes a large temporary cavity than something that doesn’t. My evidence is anecdotal, as ballistics gel is not a perfect substitute for flesh (let alone not accounting for bone and tougher muscles like a heart), and it’s not like I can go ask a dead bear what hurt worse (though if I’m doing the hunting thing right, neither is ideally all that painful and the critter is dead and on it’s way to being bear biscuits before it knows what happened - I AM kinda heartless, but a bear dying ugly is seriously the saddest sound you will ever hear), though the permanent cavity is always larger with a faster expanding bullet in my experience. Would really be interesting to see this reflected in game though, because the logic of it is there, at least in my head. All that said, not a big expert on this aspect of things as I live in a country where we don’t typically shoot at eachother very often and this sort of information is typically collected to study the effectiveness of a bullet against a person, not an animal, who react very, very differently to being shot.
Oh, FYI, I played with a scale today, and it turns out that an AA battery is actually only about 60gr lighter than a 1 oz 12 ga slug. While that’s sizeable in general gun terms, it’s not THAT big a difference when both projectiles weigh 300gr+ (something like 380gr in an energizer VS 435gr for the slug). Actual FT-LBS of energy is going to be fairly close. While expansion still sucks (relevant VS zombies IMO), the penetration would appear to be far superior (relevant VS anything armored), and I bet if that thing keyholes it would f*ck someone’s day up nicely. I stand kinda corrected, to the point that I may have to chronograph an AA and see where it sits on the KO chart.
Sorry if this is all horribly off-topic. Just fun to talk about guns in a way I really never get to at work (where no-one cares about .22 twist rates and the stopping power of a double A :P).
Thank you Apa, I now want to be a Gunsmith.
Well, for what it’s worth, most of the guys in this industry are missing at least one finger (I’m young and still have ten, yay!), and the pay sucks compared to what you can do with basic machine skills in pretty much any other field.
On the plus side, you DO get to play with guns all day, need no formal education, and it does help you make valid points in very limited situations on the internet.
On the plus side, you DO get to play with guns all day, need no formal education, and it does help you make valid points in very limited situations on the internet.[/quote]
You had me at ‘guns’.
On the plus side, you DO get to play with guns all day, need no formal education, and it does help you make valid points in very limited situations on the internet.[/quote]
You had me at ‘guns’.[/quote]
GUNS!!! <,< >,> oh sorry. In other news Apathetic welcome to come hunting out at my place whenever ^.^ Maybe I can get my neighbor the FBI WMD subject matter expert (or something like that) to come out at the same time if you ever swing by. 
SOOO much stuff will go boom ^.^
^If this day ever happens my life will be complete and I will have no complaints regrets of any kind at all.