@Rivet. Yup you got me, I am in fact city-folk, so I can’t speak for the weapon distribution of rural areas, but I still think much of what I’ve said regarding guns and bows holds true. In the case of guns requiring a high degree of skill to operate over long distances or targeting moving targets, yes, this is true. But as Granade mentioned, Zombies are slow moving targets and in terms of long range I mean far enough that the zombies don’t notice you, but you can see them clearly (I assume this is a bit beyond throwing range with adequate cover, but I leave that to the devs decision). Gun skill shouldn’t matter all that much, in such a range, with such targets. Furthermore, guns are just easier to use than bows for simple reason that less muscular exertion is necessary, they are also more accurate because of the intrinsic physics of the weapon (rifling, which gives spin to the bullet, allows much greater accuracy than a bow and arrow)
I’ve mentioned balance in my previous post, in that instance, I meant it as an imbalance in content (as in more content for a particular thing, less for another). I also did give a solution (one which is already in the works, and has been suggested before), which is to allow mods to make such content optional.
Regarding other rpgs and item progression, while you do have a point that such things are necessary in almost all rpgs, my argument is that it should take much longer to get to that point in DDA. The event horizon should not be possible within an in-game week, and the best weapons and armor in the game should not be easily craftable. Furthermore there are cases where item progression is simplified while still retaining replayablity, my prime example for this is Sil. Still, I do realize such games are exceptions and not the rule.
Also, I haven’t played any of the experimental versions yet so I can’t speak of whats in the works. I only have a general idea based on what is posted on the forums. But from 0.A I haven’t seen any weapon degradation, if its coming up, then that’s great.
@Granade
You have a point with immersion being different from atmosphere, but I think the flavor content should help with both. Furthermore, situationaly useful items are well and good, so are “useless” items. I’m not saying you should remove them, (what would be the point of that really?) I’m saying rather than adding more “content” you should add more “features”. A.I, stealth, enemy behaviors, z-levels and other such things, while harder and longer to implement, would have a greater effect on gameplay, then more weapons, more armor and more stuff.
I don’t really understand what points you’re trying to make with your discussion of bows and guns. I’m saying guns are intrinsically (by design and physical laws) better than bows. This is obviously offset by the points you mentioned (particularly, infinite ammo and easy practice with bows). But bows require a much greater degree of accuracy and skill than guns. Wind, distance and angles become a great consideration with large heavy projectiles like arrows, but virtually non-existent with small, spinning bullets (except over great distances). It doesn’t matter if the enemy is slow, or if he is moving, bows are harder to use than guns in both cases. Also, regarding rarity of bows I meant modern composite one’s you can find at a store, not homemade ones. However, if they are common in rural areas, then I retract my statement, I was only speaking from my own city-experience.
I still think rarity implies power in some way, or should. To do otherwise, seems a bit unfair. But I do like that the level of realism is adjusted to make things more balanced. This is sensible in my opinion.
I am not “abandoning” my earlier argument regarding imbalance of content, I was merely raising a different point regarding intrinsic differences in bows and guns, and how they are not reflected in the game.
Finally, the solution to the “variety illusion” is not to equalize everything (i.e make this weapon as good as any other), but to create true variety by creating different gameplay. The bow’s true strength comes from its silence, and its infinite ammunition. Yet, this is irrelevant most of the time, because a ranged character can usually outrun everything, making noise cancellation unnecessary (I speak of static spawn here, not dynamic) and because certain gun ammunition is so plentiful (and technically all ammo is infinite, since the world is infinite), you might as well use guns. The “best weapon” syndrome does happen, except its the weapon with the easiest to acquire ammo rather than the most powerful weapon. Its great that you rotate weapons based on ammo, but I guarantee that the weapon which gets the most use is probably the one that has the most plentiful ammo (9mm, usually) because carrying multiple weapons and ammo types is unwieldy at this point. Adding new features like stealth, would allow the bow to assume a different playstyle, creating true variety.
So I’m not saying a large variety of items is a bad thing, far from it. I’m saying the content in the game so far, only gives the illusion of variety. Back to the topic of the op, I think Cata 2 will succeed in this respect: that there will be more “features” and less “content”, less “things” and more “ways to play”. At least, thats what I’m hoping for.
