What are you mutating into?

[Pthalocy]

I could see a case for some CBM’s being a bit incompatible - like diamond cornea if i somehow wound up without eyes or like, hand implants when I have tentacles maybe. For the most part though a lot of these seem like they’d be just fine for coexisting in a single individual.

[infectedmochi]

CBMs are designed specifically for human, mutations mess up and change both your inner body structure and outer body form so save for a few generic CBMs I think it’s logical that CBM and mutation is exclusive. Maybe once you’ve gone far enough into mutation path some CBMs are locked out and others decrease in efficiency/ more prone to malfunction ? The same to the reverse, once you has installed a fair amount of CBM your body will be harder to mutate/ more chance for bad mutation only?

A mutation skill screen is on github right now (it’s in wip state); so once that is in, we can have various mutations perform different abilities - similar to CBMs. So both should be useful and unique enough to warrant an exclusivity. As having both mutations and CBMs can become op quickly.

[Fish]

Also, maybe mutations make you lose CBMs and vice versa? (sorta implemented CBMs can cause genetic mutation)

[Oragepoilu]

Even if logic will say that some mutation should make cbm not available,

i want to just say fuck the logic.

mutation already got counterpart, and cbm also have somes (well, more forgiving, especially at hight skill).
Adding again another counterpart will just make people not using them, witch isn’t fun.

Even by adding a few restriction, it will just mess up the thing.

[infectedmochi]

The counterpart of mutation can be solved with purifier already unless you has crossed the threshold - once you crossed that threshold the bad mutations aren’t that bad anymore compare to the threshold benefit.
Making mutation and CBM exclusive (all of them or partially, I prefer the later) create interesting strategic choices, do I go for mutagen or do I go for CBMs? Should I drink this mutagen and risk being unable to install bionics later (and vice versa)? Instead of just hoarding them all, drink mutagens then install the pile of CBMs you collected later, making the player into a super cyborg-mutant.
Exclusivity also further differentiate mutagen and bionic into interesting categories. Anyone can drink mutagen and play the mutation gamble, if you end up with bad mutations there are purifiers for that. On the other hand, CBMs aren’t easy to install, trying to install it when you are unskilled can turn dangerous, but once installed bionics are very useful to have and generally more reliable.

[EkarusRyndren]

[quote=“infectedmochi, post:25, topic:4762”]The counterpart of mutation can be solved with purifier already unless you has crossed the threshold - once you crossed that threshold the bad mutations aren’t that bad anymore compare to the threshold benefit.
Making mutation and CBM exclusive (all of them or partially, I prefer the later) create interesting strategic choices, do I go for mutagen or do I go for CBMs? Should I drink this mutagen and risk being unable to install bionics later (and vice versa)? Instead of just hoarding them all, drink mutagens then install the pile of CBMs you collected later, making the player into a super cyborg-mutant.
Exclusivity also further differentiate mutagen and bionic into interesting categories. Anyone can drink mutagen and play the mutation gamble, if you end up with bad mutations there are purifiers for that. On the other hand, CBMs aren’t easy to install, trying to install it when you are unskilled can turn dangerous, but once installed bionics are very useful to have and generally more reliable.[/quote]

A handful of mutations interfere with the bionics, a handful of bionics are incompatible with certain trees. But I’d love to see the justification for an Alpha or Medical looking at his or her hands and going “THE FUCK ARE THESE FUCKING THINGS HOW DO I BIONICS” because they drank one too many mutigen vials.

[infectedmochi]

Maybe a little complex, but I’d like we can somehow define what bionic is compatible with what mutation/branch. Or we can generalize it to body part, that would be simpler. Head mutations are incompatible with head bionics, torso mutations are incompatible with torso bionics and so on… And then we can have flags: [MUTFRIENDLY] and [CBMFRIENDLY] for mutations like ugly or shout or minor bionic like Fingerpick.

[EkarusRyndren]

Maybe a little complex, but I’d like we can somehow define what bionic is compatible with what mutation/branch. Or we can generalize it to body part, that would be simpler. Head mutations are incompatible with head bionics, torso mutations are incompatible with torso bionics and so on… And then we can have flags: [MUTFRIENDLY] and [CBMFRIENDLY] for mutations like ugly or shout or minor bionic like Fingerpick.

The problem is I don’t see the most confounded snout effecting Targeting System, most the “hands” don’t complicate the hand-area bionics, and a lot of the others, take the armor installs for example, would be “rejected” after mutating, but re-installing it would be fine.

…When I’m done drawing I’ll try to put together a system or some shit… or at least an “ideal” how it’d work… XD

[KA101]

If Fey Eyes give any morale that’s probably a bug.

Ekarus et al: if you want me to spend even more time futzing about with the infrastructure, at least show me what Lizard!Ekarus would look like post-augmentation.

/doesn’t worry too much about intercompatibility, figures it’s an RP decision

[EkarusRyndren]

Ekarus et al: if you want me to spend even more time futzing about with the infrastructure, at least show me what Lizard!Ekarus would look like post-augmentation.

…Oh bloody hell you’re gonna make me dust off my tablet…

[EkarusRyndren]

Okay so I sat down and did a sketch as requested.

While working on this I noticed a lot of things. First off, the vast majority of the bionics are internal, most bionics have no externally visual traits. Others are small and barely noticeable.

An opinion on bionic incompatibilities, etc.

I’m going to break it into a handful of categories:

Rejected:
If the player gains the listed mutation(s) while this bionic is installed the bionic is rejected and either becomes a malfunctioning bionic or is (painfully) ejected. Cannot be re-installed until the mutation is lost.

Examples: Any hand related bionic and tentacle mutations.

Needs Upgrade:
When the player gains this mutation the affected bionic stops functioning and causes pain until it’s upgraded. (Think growing larger and being stuck with your old armor.)

Examples: Any skin mutation and super alloy plating.

I also noticed there’s no room for internal storage in the chest… So I put it in the leg. XD Visible bionics: Battery System (Cords in arm), Solar Panels (Shaved head, notice them?), Enhanced Memory Banks (Small object under ear), LED light in the head

Eye Pieces: Targeting System, etc (You can really throw anything you want here :P)

The strange hexagons can be interpreted as offensive and active defense systems… shrugs

…I tried. You asked for Ekarus, you got Ekarus. Don’t ask for Ekarus in the future, it’s creepy.

[Datanazush]

While working on this I noticed a lot of things. First off, the vast majority of the bionics are internal, most bionics have no externally visual traits. Others are small and barely noticeable.

U wot m8? Barely visible bionics? Everyone knows that the best bionic of all time, the Fusion Blaster arm, turns you into MEGAMAN.

[EkarusRyndren]

[quote=“EkarusRyndren, post:31, topic:4762”]While working on this I noticed a lot of things. First off, the vast majority of the bionics are internal, most bionics have no externally visual traits. Others are small and barely noticeable.

U wot m8? Barely visible bionics? Everyone knows that the best bionic of all time, the Fusion Blaster arm, turns you into MEGAMAN.[/quote]

Yes. That one’s visible. However Batteries, the finger tools, the eye mods, the under-skin stuff aren’t so much.

[Datanazush]

Yes. That one’s visible. However Batteries, the finger tools, the eye mods, the under-skin stuff aren’t so much.

Yeah, true that. There needs to be more bionics with drastic changes to your person, right now, you’re still generally a meatbag regardless of how many bits and pieces you put into you.

[Bonevomit]

[quote=“Oragepoilu, post:24, topic:4762”]Even if logic will say that some mutation should make cbm not available,

i want to just say fuck the logic.[/quote]
this

[KA101]

[quote=“EkarusRyndren, post:31, topic:4762”]Okay so I sat down and did a sketch as requested.

While working on this I noticed a lot of things. First off, the vast majority of the bionics are internal, most bionics have no externally visual traits. Others are small and barely noticeable.

An opinion on bionic incompatibilities, etc.

I’m going to break it into a handful of categories:

Rejected:
If the player gains the listed mutation(s) while this bionic is installed the bionic is rejected and either becomes a malfunctioning bionic or is (painfully) ejected. Cannot be re-installed until the mutation is lost.

Examples: Any hand related bionic and tentacle mutations.

Needs Upgrade:
When the player gains this mutation the affected bionic stops functioning and causes pain until it’s upgraded. (Think growing larger and being stuck with your old armor.)

Examples: Any skin mutation and super alloy plating.

I also noticed there’s no room for internal storage in the chest… So I put it in the leg. XD Visible bionics: Battery System (Cords in arm), Solar Panels (Shaved head, notice them?), Enhanced Memory Banks (Small object under ear), LED light in the head

Eye Pieces: Targeting System, etc (You can really throw anything you want here :P)

The strange hexagons can be interpreted as offensive and active defense systems… shrugs

…I tried. You asked for Ekarus, you got Ekarus. Don’t ask for Ekarus in the future, it’s creepy.[/quote]

(I regret that I was creepy with my ask. My apologies. Tell me next time! Who/what should I have asked for?)

OK. Theoretically cyber-ejection is possible and I’ve got some idea how I’d handle it. I’ll probably wait on that until after 0.A lands but I’d accept tentacles & hand-augs not working so well, for instance. Upgrading seems more a pain for coding than it’s worth, IMO.

As for the illustration, well, GURPS Bio-Tech locates flesh pockets wherever you’ve got the body mass. (Being overweight does provide room for that sort of thing.) The Long Muzzle makes an interesting point as regards surface area for solar panels; Ka’lol had them around his ears/nose/eyes. Top/head makes sense until you wear a helmet. Not sure whether you’d want 'em on the upper surface of the muzzle.

Will get back to this later. RL intervened. Later is now.

I’d envisioned Alloy Plating as full skin-replacement on the targeted area. Having Lizard!Ekarus modeling raises one issue: are those chevron-looking regions Alloy Plating–I think they’re supposed to be–or his scales? Would agree that having significant dermal mutations would cause Problems with plating and maybe the carbon weave, but I’m thinking something like Rough Skin shouldn’t assess penalties. (Head Bumps would.)

Agreed that we could use more radical augs.

[EkarusRyndren]

-snip-

I just used regular Ekarus for the image, so it’s plate scale XD That said I’m pretty much certain that any mutation that effects your “skin” would /not/ happen if you already had plating on that area (Which would complicate things…) because you’ve /removed/ the skin. Depends on how mutigen works. So you’re looking at either the mutation or the bionic being rejected there. I didn’t do armored plating because I couldn’t figure out how to draw it XD

Or do you mean the little ^ shaped bits on his forearms? Those are just markings. The triangular bits were supposed to be some active/offensive defense shield thing…

[KA101]

I meant all the >>>> looking things, no matter the location or orientation. Sorry.

Thanks for the explanation though.

[Eddiebird]

“Thresholds 101: If you inject a serum that’s the same category as the one you’ve been having lots of very specific dreams about, you may end up locking yourself permanently into that category”

So that’s why I had strange dreams of pollinating plants and serving the hive queen…

[HoundofDarkness]

I have just about every bionic, except the armor plating bionics and some of the stat-boosting ones. And I’ve got a really weird mix of mutations… I guess I’m turning into a Cell from DBZ.