I wasn’t sure about making a thread here, but not everyone on the forums follows the Github repository, so I figured it’d be about time to give the official lowdown on the new system.
Here it is, in four easy steps:
[ol][li]Every square must start with a frame. (Spikes/blades can also be put in empty squares, but no other parts can go in those squares if you do)[/li]
[li]Each part now has a ‘location’, such as “wheel” or “engine” or “on_roof”. You can only have at most one part in each location. Some parts are so small (headlights, for instance) that they have no location.[/li]
[li]You can’t have more than one identical part in a square, even if the part has no location. So you can’t have 5 headlights in a single square, for instance.[/li]
[li]Any setup of parts not prohibited by the above rules is allowed[/li][/ol]
Additionally, the various types of plating were changed so they now take up a square and block movement through it (because they’re big sheets of plating, and won’t do you much good if zombies can just walk past them). Think of them as being like transparent boards, but tougher.
(EDIT: Armor has since been changed; it has its own location and does not block movement, and can be placed on any square that doesn’t already have armor. Quarterpanels have been added to fill the ‘transparent board’ niche.)
It’s worth noting that all of the old standard vehicle configurations are allowed under the new system if extra frames are added to squares that didn’t have them before. If you load a save from before the change into the new system, the game will automatically add extra frames for you.
All you have to worry about now is that you must remember to start each square with a frame. Many more combinations of parts have been permitted by this, for instance, having a board over a wheel. Feel free to experiment!
That doesn’t sound like terrible good armor plating, then.
How significant is the defense bonus granted? Might it be worth it to have more than one type of armor installed - weaker and less effective “barred” and then the more effective but sight-blocking “plated”?
[quote=“GlyphGryph, post:6, topic:3507”]That doesn’t sound like terrible good armor plating, then.
How significant is the defense bonus granted? Might it be worth it to have more than one type of armor installed - weaker and less effective “barred” and then the more effective but sight-blocking “plated”?[/quote] I don’t want to sound like a dick, but you should research it a little bit more. These holes are actually just a slits which don’t decrease defensive capability of armor.
However, they do block your sight but not very much and you are able to see through it.
None of that seems like a particularly good justification for them working the way they do instead of in another way. I’m not even sure what you want me to “research”, since there’s nothing actually research-worthy that’s been brought up yet. They currently are completely transparent and provide just as much visibility as windows, while providing protection to the occupant. And it means it’s actually effectively impossible to block LOS for those who wish to (for example) not get shot at by spitters and shockers and their own turrets while driving through their armor plating.
You could make boards of all 3; so superalloy, hard, and spiked plating have their own opaque versions just like regular boards do. Then reduce the armor’s durability slightly to compensate for the extra vision. Would be easier than creating a new mechanic for them.
It would kinda clutter the install menu though. And transparent armor kinda negates the use of windshields completely.
The kind of slit you are talking about would only allow visions from the tile right next to said block and would not be very suited to driving as it would severely limit driving. Tankers and other armored vehicle drivers use a complex set of mirrors so they don’t have to be exposed to fire and this is still very limiting on their vision. There doesn’t exist a simple easy solution to this answer. The closest one would probably be cameras but even those don’t work exactly right.
… yeah, I guess that’s a good point. Hoods could be armor plated, but we don’t have any logic about seeing OVER armor plating. So really, armor plating is more akin to steel bumpers than anything else.
[quote=“GlyphGryph, post:12, topic:3507”]… yeah, I guess that’s a good point. Hoods could be armor plated, but we don’t have any logic about seeing OVER armor plating. So really, armor plating is more akin to steel bumpers than anything else.
Huh. Interesting dilemma.[/quote]
Not to be a pain but what was wrong with the old system as far as board VS hood is concerned? EG A Frame, Board, then Armor, everything under armor is protected, board blocks LoS while Frame armor is “hood” but doesn’t block LoS and still provides armor?
I say just take back the section where plating blocks movement and we lose the issue. Of course the armored car will have to be modified to use boards. I’m fine with that anyway. Also, the armored car shouldn’t have M249’s on it. It’s not a HUMVEE! HUMVEEs only have one machinegun on them.
I always took armor to be “armor whatever is there”, so it should block neither sight nor movement*, whatever the underlying component is should determine whether sight or movement are blocked. The excption being windhields, they should need special measures to preserve transparency when armored.
No, you can’t install wheels in a space without a frame anymore.
[quote=“Kevin Granade, post:16, topic:3507”]I always took armor to be “armor whatever is there”, so it should block neither sight nor movement*, whatever the underlying component is should determine whether sight or movement are blocked. The excption being windhields, they should need special measures to preserve transparency when armored.
No, you can’t install wheels in a space without a frame anymore.
*I have no idea if it actually works this way.[/quote]
In the previous builds that’s pretty much the way it worked (I think) with a few exceptions on things that wouldn’t be easily armored without causing issues with the component (Windows, Solar panels, etc) Personally I liked it when it worked this way, now I have to choose between armoring my vehicle had being ‘hidden’ in the back while trying to wait out the daylight… Though I don’t need glass for windows anymore, which makes my life a lot easier XD
Plating was changed to block movement and take up space like most other parts as a simpler alternative to the old system - parts were randomly flagged “NO_REINFORCE” (without much thought - you could reinforce a seat, but not a kitchen unit) and you had no way to know this except trial and error (or reading the json files).
It also didn’t work, because while you couldn’t install plating over a NO_REINFORCE part, you could put the part over the plating and that was allowed. Putting armor in its own slot would necessitate the return of the NO_REINFORCE flag.
An armored bumper is a more reasonable way to look at it, particularly since there are flavors like spiked plating available that are supposed to collide with zombies before other stuff does.
They could easily be made opaque, but that would make them inferior to boards. Not blocking movement (much like armoring a frame in the old version) helps with collisions, but not with zombies trying to break inside.
As for wheels in an empty space: nope. Everything except spikes/blades needs a frame first.
Taking up a slot yes, blocking movement is orthoganal to that, right?
Yea, it doesn’t help with keeping zombies out, it’s not supposed to, it’s just supposed to protect the parts that DO keep zombies out.
This sounds like an easy fix, remove movement blocking from armor, and update vehicle designs to have boards, doors, or windshields where they want to block movement. I’m pretty sure that’s what’s intended.
