Mugling is unfit to be a developer

Indeed, all this topic seems to accomplish (at least for me) is raise moderate concern about things I can’t confirm and bring into question the reliability of all devs involved. Perhaps RD in particular. Shooting first and thinking later never did me any favors and it sure doesn’t help here.

This thread was a mistake.

I don’t know any thing of what really happened etc but I’m gutted that it did.

As said by me loads of times :stuck_out_tongue: the cdda community is amazeing and what every one contributes to it is beyond awesome.

Can we just not get along.

Random dragon has made some amazeing contributions to cdda along with so many others.

Please every one forgive and move on pleaseeeeeeeee.

Then you probably shouldn’t be commenting on it.

kind of agree.
but im still correct in saying that the CDDA comunity is awesome :stuck_out_tongue:

Kevin wanted RD out for:
Being a jackass about any refusal, bringing up personal grievances in unrelated threads/issues/PRs, not testing own PRs, playing a victim when criticized (especially when the criticism was spot on) and refusing to drop the bullshit even after being directly asked to do so.

Random Dragon, it’s the third time I’m explicitly telling you to knock it off.
Third time. And that’s just me.
You realize you’re acting like a jackass. How about realize it BEFORE you do it next time?

Mugling can be abrasive, but he has good reasons: he put a lot of work into unfucking the code and a lot of it involved orphaned content people only care about when it is to be dropped.
Most people only see “my feature isn’t working = bad”, but don’t realize how much shit was untangled in the code, allowing to actually maintain things and add new features. Similar for new content that requires new features or ones that are about to be removed. Maintenance isn’t cheap - I myself dropped multiple of my PRs just because they would have to work with current code, which often is simply unworkable.
Development isn’t a democracy primarily because actually fixing thing is much harder than throwing ideas around.
By the way, the fuel balance and multiple engines being broken are acknowledged bugs, not intended.

Ironically your screenshot proves you edited your own post after others had already replied. As to deleting posts it was a different developer (illi-kun) who moderated one of your posts yesterday and they told you this directly in #19291.

See I’ve edited over half a million lines, the most of any active contributor and the second highest overall whereas the OP has edited 1’500 - that’s 0.3% which is fairly indicative of our relative contributions to the project. In case that isn’t enough I also wrote a large part of the mod testing infrastructure, most of the new JSON loading code and along with codemime fixed a lot of our unit tests. I’d say it’s fairly apparent that I’m productive and care about code quality and error checking.

You PM me some abuse every so often but I’ve never replied so the latter part of that statement is entirely redundant. This thread demonstrates how much you confuse right to free speech with a right to audience. You can say what you like but that doesn’t mean anybody has to listen.

A not unfair assessment. I’m active in most of the projects open issues so time is limited. New contributors often write lengthy posts to which there simply isn’t time to reply to in-kind. Others expect continuous replies until they concede which also isn’t realistic when you’re juggling a dozen conversations. New contributors usually get a link to an issue, PR or the relevant code from me along with come concise comments. If you’ve identified a bug or significant deficiency you’ll often get a fix or some documentation written for you. People will listen because you are skilled or persuasive - I’m aiming for the former. I’m not sure what the OP is aiming for but I think the replies to this thread illustrate it’s not persuasive.

Kevin banned you. I’ve warned you before. illi-kun has rebuked you twice within a month and Coolthulhu three times on the forums. Other replies here suggest you take a leave of absence. It’s quite apparent you are the problem and not the victim. As others have pointed out you’ve gone for maximum exposure here and severely miscalculated how much support you would get. We’d have to throw out most of the active development team to keep you happy. As we’re not going to be stalling or forking the project on account of your rants unless you have anything civil and constructive to say it might be best to focus your efforts elsewhere.

Right. I get it. As I’ve said, I’m not good at voicing my objections.

You’ve been told on GH that you can continue Arcana in your own repo and expect the same support that we provide to other third-party mod developers providing you restrict yourself to comments directly concerning your mod and remain civil at all times. That’s eminently reasonable given the circumstances and is the last junction before we start actively enforcing Kevin’s original ban on Github.

Be aware that Github now actually has an option to explicitly ban a user which wasn’t available at the time of your original expulsion. If Kevin returns and wanted to apply that I’d be surprised if any of the other developers would object. As such I’m not granting you any reprieve and have no suggestions as to what you might do about this.


Ditto. This is the STRATEGY forum, not the development/modding forum.

How can you be mad at Mugling over a coding disagreement when you don’t even know how to post in the right forum? Your conduct is hateful and unprofessional.

What does forum post etiquette have to do with code quality? Nothing. Stop dogpiling.

[quote=“BorkBorkGoesTheCode, post:31, topic:13011”][quote=“RedPine, post:30, topic:13011”]
How can you be mad at Mugling over a coding disagreement when you don’t even know how to post in the right forum? Your conduct is hateful and unprofessional.
What does forum post etiquette have to do with code quality? Nothing. Stop dogpiling.

Context is important. Trying to incite a fork on the front page of the projects public forum is ugly and won’t do anything to help us attract and retain developers.

OP has begun further editing some of their more offensive posts on Github and should acknowledge this publicly. Retracting comments you no longer wish to stand by is reasonable whereas silently changing them is deceptive. GH publishes comments via it’s API in real time, they are also emailed to subscribers and edited posts are marked so acknowledgement would be better than the alternatives.

In my personal opinion, I believe the time for tolerance has come and gone.

If what I have read is true and everything is as I have come to understand it, RD should be banned and ties severed. It’s not the first time he’s been told to stop and it’s obviously not going to be the last. If he had any intention of correcting his behavior it would have happened by now. No more patience, cut the dead weight. I personally have zero tolerance for this kind of fuckery because I have been on the giving end of plenty and I happen to know that it is inexcusable.

Assuming anyone cares. There’s a good chance no one does. But those are my thoughts. I’m sure they are shared in some capacity among the devs in charge.

^ Says he can’t really confirm accusations from either side, and tells others who say basically the same thing to shut up. Then proceeds to suddenly know everything about it and suggest a radical course of action less than a dozen posts later.


Anyway, guys, RD has voluntarily left to cool off. He understands what’s expected of him. Yeah, this was not appropriate, at all. I rather like the guy, but that’s just the reality of it.

But being dicks about it after he’s left and saying he should be banned, or attacking what he has said after he’s made it clear he’s no longer going to defend himself or argue is not really a ton better. Why don’t the people here take the high road and also leave it alone for now?

I get that this is not a first chance, or the first time there’s been an issue between him and others, but it kinda leaves a sour taste to see people (particularly the person this should most offend) say “Cut it out. Here’s how it is. Deal with it, or leave, and don’t do this again or you aren’t coming back”, have him agree to the terms and agree he maybe needs to cool down and go away for a bit, and then have everyone pile on him after he’s gone.

Well, the man thought something was seriously wrong and he spoke up. Can’t blame a person for that. And what is the proper place to voice concerns something such as this? Everyone’s saying “this is the wrong way” but what then is the right way?

Three of your four points are inaccurate.

I reserve the right to be mistaken and will assume correct until proven otherwise.

Then I guess I’m just radically misunderstanding what you mean about things you can’t confirm.

That seems pretty straightforward though.

As I tried to get across, this should now be as resolved as it’s gonna be. The guy who this was directed at did not call for a ban, but stated this was the last chance. As I also tried to get across, that means we should just let this die instead of dragging it to the top of the page in order to make comments that are, realistically speaking, pretty irrelevant compared to those made by people who are actually involved.

I appreciate the work mugling does on the game, but shouldn’t the changes have been reverted on the main branch until they were in a playable state?

You should always be tolerable. RD has done good work with his mods and he’s known around here—he is NOT “dead weight.” Surely we don’t ban people just because they feel the need to speak out because nobody else will listen? We certainly don’t ban people because you personally dislike the way they act. You don’t know what’s going on in RD’s life, and you don’t know RD, so please try to go easy on him. You’re not in any position to make a ban request and I’m quite appalled at your treatment of someone who is practically a stranger to you.

That being said, it’s pretty clear that this forum needs a board for threads like this to go in. Nobody should be forced to “go public” like this because they feel like they have nowhere else to turn. A sub-board for administrative complaints, like many other forums have, should be made specifically for situations like this.

Well, there you go. I’m wrong. I guess I don’t know how patient one is expected to be for these sorts of things. I was not thinking of work he has done at the time, which he has indeed done, I play his mods as well. It was late and I hadn’t thought much out of what I meant to say. You are correct, just dropping the ban hammer without further consideration isn’t the most reasonable course of action.

That said, it was advice. I have no expectation of people acting based on my suggestions.

I’ll refrain from commenting on this thread further in the interest of letting the original topic drop.