Total HP loss from raging fire

[Benedict]

So what’s this business I’ve been hearing about, how do I avoid it, and how does it work?

So for a list of questions:

1. How close must one be to raging fires to incur max HP loss?
2. How rapid is this HP loss?
3. What is this intended to add, game-wise?

(Tbh, I sort of get why it should damage your HP to even be near a super-hot fire, but not why the damage should be permanent, when it’s impossible to change HP in the other direction. Surely this means the inevitable death of any character, in an infinitely running cataclysm game :P)

[Labtop_215]

I don’t think it’s intended from what I can tell. It should just deduct from your regular hp pool but it takes from your max for no reason.

[Iosyn]

First time I stepped in a raging fire I died outright, there and then. From full HP.
Until I stepped in it? Nadda.

As for avoiding it… Grab a fire extinguisher, but don’t expect much.
Also damage isn’t permanent until you get 0 HP on your limbs. Just sleep the rest of it off.
A broken (0HP) limb can be regenerated at a hospital. Of course, finding and raiding a hospital with only one arm and no legs could be a chore.

[Caconym]

[quote=“Iosyn, post:3, topic:984”]First time I stepped in a raging fire I died outright, there and then. From full HP.
Until I stepped in it? Nadda.

As for avoiding it… Grab a fire extinguisher, but don’t expect much.
Also damage isn’t permanent until you get 0 HP on your limbs. Just sleep the rest of it off.
A broken (0HP) limb can be regenerated at a hospital. Of course, finding and raiding a hospital with only one arm and no legs could be a chore.[/quote]
Unless you had the foresight to raid one before you broke your arms and legs.

[kilozombie]

Raging fire does cause permanent health damage, though, Iosyn.

I’m gonna guess some coder (Whales) implemented max HP loss, and another coder (DDA team) accidentally made standing near Raging Fire use that formula instead of the default damage of health.

[Iosyn]

[quote=“kilozombie, post:5, topic:984”]Raging fire does cause permanent health damage, though, Iosyn.

I’m gonna guess some coder (Whales) implemented max HP loss, and another coder (DDA team) accidentally made standing near Raging Fire use that formula instead of the default damage of health.[/quote]
Ah, indeed? Didn’t know that. Goddamn, but that sounds kinda broken. Of course, I can see extensive burn scarring lowering your max HP.
Maybe we should have some burn cream or something implemented that can counteract this, because if you managed to survive and didn’t have self-aware you’re fucked.

[kilozombie]

Ooh, yeah, burn cream would be sweet.

You would only be able to rub it on burned parts so non-Self Aware peeps get a fair share as well.

You rub the burn cream all over your left arm! It catches you on fire!

[Shoes]

[quote=“Benedict, post:1, topic:984”]So what’s this business I’ve been hearing about, how do I avoid it, and how does it work?

So for a list of questions:

1. How close must one be to raging fires to incur max HP loss?
2. How rapid is this HP loss?
3. What is this intended to add, game-wise?

(Tbh, I sort of get why it should damage your HP to even be near a super-hot fire, but not why the damage should be permanent, when it’s impossible to change HP in the other direction. Surely this means the inevitable death of any character, in an infinitely running cataclysm game :P)[/quote]

So I am the one who coded this, and didn’t really test it I was adding frostbite, so I added blisters too. Frostbite got fixed, blisters will get fixed!

1. It depends on how much you are wearing. Warmth value of the clothing is also fire protection value. The closer your are, and the hotter the fire, the more dangerous.

2. Too rapid, I think. Some time ago, these calculations happened every 10th turn, now they happen every turn. That means that you get blisters 10 times too often (oops!). Maybe more than 10, because no one has actually ever gotten burned by fire and spoke of it.

3. I was under the impression that losing max health was like losing stats; when the disease was cured, so was the stat loss. I am under the impression that this is not the case (please correct me if I am wrong!). The intent of fire damaging the body is just that… if the fire is really big, you start to burn and melt. The idea of losing max hp instead of normal hp is that you can’t sorta bandage yourself back into shape.

What you guys are seeing is like an alpha build of taking fire damage via blisters. You are pioneers!

(now I have two threads to watch…)

[The_Darkling_Wolf]

Nope. Max HP loss is permanant. When you lose stats from illness, it’s taking it from foo_cur, not foo_max.
So Glare reduces u.per_cur by one, if it reduced u.per_max by one, you’d permanantly lose all your perception after a few turns in sunlight.

[FrankyPlaysGames]

[quote=“The Darkling Wolf, post:9, topic:984”]Nope. Max HP loss is permanant. When you lose stats from illness, it’s taking it from foo_cur, not foo_max.
So Glare reduces u.per_cur by one, if it reduced u.per_max by one, you’d permanantly lose all your perception after a few turns in sunlight.[/quote]
THE SUNLIGHT HURTS MY EYES
WUBWUBWUBWUBWUBWUBWUBWUBWUB

On another note, I experience a game crash, I started a fire in my mansion to cook some meat (for some reason I thought it would be ok) and I cooked a piece just fine, but furing the cooking of the second piece it interrupted me with “Heard an explosion, stop crafting?”.
I hit "Y"es and then I saw craters in a weird formation on my screen where the fire was, and through the walls the fire was closest too.
Didn’t get to see much though, my game crashed. The only explanation I really have is that it burned through the wall to my item stockpiles, but I had no guns or explosives (except for firecrackers) to be exploded.

[KA101]

IIRC being near lava carries the same perma-damage effect as being in raging fire? I ran into a lava strip clear across my second Mine, right before the finale. Since it was diagonal one could walk right past it, but proximity heat-damage would recommend an alternate approach.

[Flare]

[quote=“Iosyn, post:3, topic:984”]First time I stepped in a raging fire I died outright, there and then. From full HP.
Until I stepped in it? Nadda.[/quote]

Are you sure you didn’t miss it? I sure did the couple half dozen times I was walking around and realized I was in a great deal of pain. Being around 3-4 tiles is pretty much when you’ll start hurting.
It is repeatably, try it out.

Edit: 3 tile range is for 1 raging fire. When it’s a wall of raging fire, it goes up to 6 tiles.

[Asra]

IIRC being near lava carries the same perma-damage effect as being in raging fire? I ran into a lava strip clear across my second Mine, right before the finale. Since it was diagonal one could walk right past it, but proximity heat-damage would recommend an alternate approach.

I remember a version or two where I managed to walk across an entire volcanic rift without dying until I died of thirst and drinking sewage on the other side. I’m not sure if lava is the same as fire in regards to permanent HP loss though, but it sounds like it is.

[KA101]

[quote=“Flare, post:12, topic:984”][quote=“Iosyn, post:3, topic:984”]First time I stepped in a raging fire I died outright, there and then. From full HP.
Until I stepped in it? Nadda.[/quote]

Are you sure you didn’t miss it? I sure did the couple half dozen times I was walking around and realized I was in a great deal of pain. Being around 3-4 tiles is pretty much when you’ll start hurting.
It is repeatably, try it out.

Edit: 3 tile range is for 1 raging fire. When it’s a wall of raging fire, it goes up to 6 tiles.[/quote]
Hmm. Is it possible that the maxHP loss doesn’t affect the HP readout of non-SelfAware characters, so you continue to be at “full”/dark green until “full”=0?

[Flare]

Oh no, it still goes to yellow when you stand around a raging fire long enough.

[Soron]

Shoes: https://github.com/TheDarklingWolf/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/710

The knowledge of it was bugging me slightly, and this seemed like the simplest fix. If you want to properly implement it instead, go for it - that sounds like something that would be interesting to see. But, IMO, this is a case where it’s better to nerf something rather than leave it in a half-implemented state.

[Shoes]

[quote=“Soron, post:16, topic:984”]Shoes: https://github.com/TheDarklingWolf/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/710

The knowledge of it was bugging me slightly, and this seemed like the simplest fix. If you want to properly implement it instead, go for it - that sounds like something that would be interesting to see. But, IMO, this is a case where it’s better to nerf something rather than leave it in a half-implemented state.[/quote]

Yeah, I had a fix like that ready to push. It would be neat to revisit temporary loss of max_hp for burns and other grave injuries.

[pingpong]

Maybe a fix could be as simple as something in a hospital or building re-healing you up until max hp. For now, presumably, nothing can increase max hp, so for anyone who’s character is currently borked, you can heal it to whatever their strength indicates - that way, hopefully, anyone who has issues can get to that health before something is implemented which can raise max health independently of strength - or even then, the base max-health-from-strength attribute, a positive variable, and negative variable indicate current max, and that’d work out for healing purposes, as it could work solely on the negative variable. The last arrangement wouldn’t fix current health damage, but it wouldn’t hurt any normal players, and if it is used overtop of the current health system, could instantly help anyone who’s currently burned (could call it a one-time act of mercy), while subsequent burns would work properly to increase the negative health variable as they should. If it’s not clear, the way it would help the damaged players, is when they’d load their save, their max health would go back to normal, but their current health wouldn’t change.

On further thought, since lowered strength doesn’t correlate to decreased max health, maybe that system would only be good on a new build. Either way, lowering max health is bad in its current state, I think we can agree on that. Or let decreased strength modify current health, that way poison could be a LOT more dangerous, and it might make it more strategic to go high str instead of the other skills (without changing its effect on melee).