Did the gameplay become more tedious lately?

[TheFlame52]

E: Mashing the R key over and over again is fine until you’ve got a grey part with no replacement on hand or a part that you don’t have the mechanics skill to repair yet. Then you have to go around to each vehicle square individually and repair what you can. So I guess what I really want is a ‘repair all that I can right now’ button.

This. Sometimes something breaks, but I can’t repair it yet because of time/lack of materials, and I can’t remove it because it’s got stuff in it.

As for holding ‘r’, I’ve got my Grinding Egg that I just set on the ‘r’ while I check my phone.

[Random_dragon]

Yep. Enjoy trying to lay an egg on the r key when there’s a stubborn broken part you can’t replace, or something high-level. ;w;

[Voqar]

The game got harder in general. Difficulty has an element of tedium to it, since you need to be more careful.

I don’t feel like the game got harder but more like the OP states, it feels more tedious in some ways. Also more convenient in some ways too though.

Most of the stuff that’s done to the game is pretty awesome and i’m ultimately thankful for the effort and nonstop goodness that happens. I don’t always agree with every change but that’s just life.

I too think that realism can be taken a bit too far - selectively - at times. For ex, I don’t think the gun clip thing adds anything except tedium. Melee is very abstracted. Stopping to reload is inconvenience enough most of the time. You already have a ton of different types of guns and ammo (and ammo types). The clips just add an extra degree of micro that seems overdone for just this one element vs most other things. I don’t see this as an increase in difficulty, as I don’t equate tedium with difficulty.

I didn’t like the exotic melee weapons being made more rare either (more replicas and crap versions instead) because that takes choice away. Probably done in some desire to make the game harder but I don’t see it that way, it just pushes you more towards the ultra plentiful guns. So you have less choice. Find shotgun, done (because why bother with guns that use clips either). I also used to mix bows with melee - silent killing, but with the early push towards guns now, I usually don’t bother with archery anymore.

I used to make it be like a quest to try to find an exotic melee weapon - visit museums, pawn shops, mansions. Now I’m better off just getting books and building my own sword rather than waste time with those locations. By the time that happens I have ridiculous amounts of ammo and a variety of sweet guns. I feel like one of my favorite parts of the game was gutted, and keep hoping someone will make a mod to undo the change.

I didn’t like the changes to the repair stuff at first but overall, I think it’s good, because it can reduce a lot of repetitive action. I don’t mind more mats being necessary (even if gathering thread is even more of a minigame now - disassembling for thread takes forever - my survivors are more concerned with gathering thread than food/drink)

[John_Candlebury]

I didn’t like the changes to the repair stuff at first but overall, I think it’s good, because it can reduce a lot of repetitive action. I don’t mind more mats being necessary (even if gathering thread is even more of a minigame now - disassembling for thread takes forever - my survivors are more concerned with gathering thread than food/drink)

Make sure you disassemble long strings for thread, not rags, it’s much faster and convenient.

[pisskop]

The gun clip bit is a platform for expanding the game, and limits he amount of firepower you can put out earlier on.

Endgame is the problem the game suffers from. A suit of power armor and you can rip through most things.

Survivors in general arent following the rule of thumb that crap they find will be better than what they can make. In terms of timecost and material gathering and whonot its supposed to be tedious for that guarentte of the item. Well, you can always fail, but enh.

Undertandably people want to be able to make cool stuff, whether because RP or escapism or because they can be ensured to have it.

I think one problem is how short games can be. You grind up to your top, and one stray bullet and its gone. That said, I think you gain experience too fast. Even as a slow learner, Im learning to make things at an astounding rate. Perhaps you should level up slower, and then this helps balance out the myriad of crap you can find for free. Since, you know, everyone is dead?

I think that people are taking the ease of access for granted somewhat, and we should be restricting access to the top level crafts by making it level slower and by making this a game about the aftermath of the apocolypse rather than the 3-24 weeks after it? When 1 character dies I jump into another one, and the frind begins again.

[Thwap]

I’m still doing all my real playing on an experimental from late last year. The magazine thing is incredibly irritating and adds nothing to the experience.

[Random_dragon]

It’s a game balance thing. That said, the availability of magazines with higher-than-standard capacities means there is SOME use to this feature. There is some benefit, in addition to its added complexity.

Though at the moment, hold off until the crash-inducing bug that won’t die gets fixed.

[Tawarochir]

That said, the availability of magazines with higher-than-standard capacities means there is SOME use to this feature.

Actually, the older versions had extra-length magazines as gun mods.

[Random_dragon]

True. Though there’s still the ammo pouch thingies. :V

[Malkeus]

So negative…give it time people, the end goal is to have magazines just work, without a bunch of finicky inventory management beyond having the magazines on your person. As close to this goal as mugling is right now, I don’t see any reason why it won’t be achieved. Finding more magazines to extend your combat time will just be part of the game one day soon.

And crash bugs get the most attention, it won’t be around long now that it’s been pinned down. It’s caused by screen width below 94, the reload dialog doesn’t get created properly and leads to a crash. I won’t claim to understand the coding behind it, but I can think of at least 3 or 4 people who do, and one of them probably wrote it. Easy fix time.

[Random_dragon]

Still continues to be the most arcane bug cause I’ve ever seen.

And yeah. Personally? I’m liking these magazine additions far more than I liked the repair nerf.

[Coolthulhu]

gathering thread is even more of a minigame now - disassembling for thread takes forever - my survivors are more concerned with gathering thread than food/drink

Use the mass disassembly command under the same key as butchery.
There is a bug where it doesn’t unlock if all items on the tile stack with each other (for example, strings), but if you have a single short and a single long string on the same tile, you can issue the command. The survivor will then automatically disassemble all strings - long to short and then short to thread.

[Malkeus]

Ejseto explains it pretty well in the issue on github. Lookup null pointer dereference in google, it was an interesting read and explains what seems to be occurring.

The ammo window doesn’t get created, the pointer to the window being passed is instead a null pointer (which is misleading as hell, because null doesn’t mean nothing in this case, it literally means anything…) When the game tries to use the null pointer, it crashes because the data it gets back isn’t what it’s expecting and it wasn’t told how to check for or handle it. Yet.

This stuff makes me wish I’d paid attention in class, it’s interesting as hell and yet gives me a headache…

edit: Muglings recent work on the magazine spawns issue: https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/15472#issuecomment-186088532

[Voqar]

Use the mass disassembly command under the same key as butchery.

Yes but…I didn’t think this game was a tailoring or thread gathering simulation. If you are spending hours/days on thread, that’s not exactly my idea of fun or great gameplay.

I started a new run with a version DL’d last night and sat there watching my character attempt to do a simple alteration to a shirt for 3+ hours, burning 400 thread, with no feedback (used to see repeated fail/repair msgs but there seems to be huge stretches/hours with nothing now).

I don’t think the idea of needing more mats is bad per se, but there is a point where things get to be a bit excessive.

Need a new textile mill POI with 1000’s of thread in crates or something.

I don’t equate tedium or time sink with challenge. There’s no challenge to getting cloth items to scrap for rags or thread. There’s no challenge in breaking stuff down into thread. It’s just a lot of time doing something mundane to do it. What is really being gained here?

PS - since the game is updated quite often, I grabbed the very latest in hopes of this having been tweaked since I DL’d, since it’s definitely more “intense” than a week or two ago.

[pisskop]

But you arent spending DAYs on thread.

My character is slow learner and he had level 5 tailoring by night 03. And thats spending a day getting out of the city with enough supplies to make it.

Go smash windows. Take the long strings. And the sheets if you can. Each sheet is 14-20 rags for a newbie, and with an hour of work you can break a long string into 300 thread.

If you need a seweing kit you can smash for nails, 15-30 of them, and craft fishing hooks until lvl 1 fabrication and make a bone or wood needle from skewers.

You craft hand/foot wraps from rags until level 1.
You make arm warmers until level 2.
You can then begin fleshing out your clothing if youre like me and start underequipped. Or practice on Zed clothing until level 3.

At level 3 you can pretty well REPAIR any civilian clothing. Theres still chances to fail though.
At level 4 or 5 you can reliably refit clothing. And fortify them if you feel up to it. Fortifying isnt a neccessary as some might think.

So no. My slow learning, 7 dex drunkard (who needs a drink every hour or he shakes his way to Zero dex) can do this in all of 3 to 4 days. And the time goes by pretty quickly if you dont need to forage for berries/water.

I wrote a whole guide on it, and I suspect that some of that guide is the reason nerfings happened >.<

Honestly. coupled with books, you can have a welding rig and fully fortified melee/armor in like 12 days. And thats being conservative and assuming you have to scavange the parts.

[Coolthulhu]

[quote=“Voqar, post:34, topic:11418”]Yes but…I didn’t think this game was a tailoring or thread gathering simulation. If you are spending hours/days on thread, that’s not exactly my idea of fun or great gameplay.

I started a new run with a version DL’d last night and sat there watching my character attempt to do a simple alteration to a shirt for 3+ hours, burning 400 thread, with no feedback (used to see repeated fail/repair msgs but there seems to be huge stretches/hours with nothing now).[/quote]

Don’t equate time loss on crafting/repairing with player time loss on keypresses.
If you want to waste days on practicing tailoring, which isn’t the most efficient use of in-game time, it’s your choice and not mandatory tedium. You could spend that time gathering a food surplus in a forest, scouting for libraries/gun shops/garages or just hunting zombies for experience and items.

Reinforcement no longer provides bonus armor, now it simply provides a buffer against item damage.
Also, it isn’t a simple alteration. Currently it is a strict improvement over the brand new factory-made version.

No feedback is because otherwise you’d have 100 “you sew x/your practice sewing on x”. If feedback is desired, it could be something like “you spent last 30 minutes sewing x with no effect, using up 60 thread” every 30 minutes or so.

[Malkeus]

Speaking of feedback, a report on how much thread is left in your needle /sewing kit after an item is damaged /repaired /reinforced would be awesome. I spend an inordinate amount of time opening my inventory to check thread levels so I can spread the repairs evenly when I’m getting a survivor started.

[Random_dragon]

Reinforcement no longer provides bonus armor, now it simply provides a buffer against item damage.

It is terrifying.

[Tawarochir]

Reinforcement no longer provides bonus armor, now it simply provides a buffer against item damage.

This just seems unnecessary, really. It only barely upped your armor rating before, why remove it? Wouldn’t it make more sense that my reinforced shirt would prevent damage more than my non-reinforced shirt?

[pisskop]

It was an armorboost of 33% in some cases.

2x2s became 3x3,armor, and 4x4 coats became 6x6

derp. 50%. Some items got 50% more armor