Crazy idea about adding various USA states

[TheKobold]

Does this mean that we are potentially going to get real roads and highways instead of just the two lane roads?

[ecchi_squid]

Z level overpasses please. I want to live under a bridge.

[TheKobold]

That will make the hobo life feel real.

[Wasylus]

I don’t understand. Does it mean that CDDA will be abandoning the procedural generation model in the future?

[Zhilkin]

Nope procedural mapgen won’t be dropped in forseeable future.

[Wojtek94]

So what is going on right now? Was it just a test? Will it be implemented at some point in the future of Cataclysm?

[Zhilkin]

There’s been a “secret” project running for about a month to do a test import of GIS data for the state of Massachusetts, the whole thing, roads, building zones, forests, railways, hiking trails, beaches, subways, airports, cranberry bogs, rivers, islands, lakes, hospitals, city halls, everything.

We don’t know yet what it will be in the end.

[kevin.granade]

Short term (once its implemented, its an unusable prototype right now), there would be character generation options to spawn somewhere in Mass instead of the current pseudo- new england area.

Thats the only part of it thats really concrete right now.

Once you leave the bounds of Mass it would go back to procedural generation.

There might be future imports of other data, either importing other areas in a similarly high resolution (Alaska and Denmark have been called out as having good data available) , or importing areas in a lower resolution, such as y importing just the highway system and city locations rather than all if the detailed land use data.

[Wasylus]

So in the end it does sound like an (potential) attempt at replacing full procedural MAP generation with pre-made maps or parts of maps. I’m not sure I like the idea. In fact I’m almost certain that I don’t and that it’s a move in the wrong direction. Even if it will be only an option (assuming it happens at all) it will still detract time and effort from improving procedural generation code which should be in my opinion priority.
On the other hand if You find it a fun thing to work on, then I hope I’m wrong (good chance that I am !) and the result will be something really cool. Fingers crossed.

[Zhilkin]

If you do not like anything in the game, take your time and start improving map generation.

[Wasylus]

Who the hell told You that I “don’t like anything in the game”. I like plenty of things in CDDA. Most of things in fact. That’s way I play this game after all. I even like most of the things some people were very vocal at disliking in the past (like the dirty clothing). However even if I had the time and willingness to do as you suggest, I have near zero knowledge in programming. I was just commenting on the potential possible move to a pre-made map model. Which is interesting but naturally has some consequences. As any development decision.

[kevin.granade]

it will still detract time and effort from improving procedural generation code which should be in my opinion priority.

That’s pretty much not possible, considering the fact that procedural map generation at overmap scale has had essentially no effort expended on it in many years. No one in the project has shown interest in working on it. The tradeoff is between nothing, and map import. Given those alternatives, going with a map import is the obvious choice.

[Wasylus]

That’s a good point actually. I still think that in an ideal world going with procedural generation is the superior choice for CDDA but as You said, between nothing and something there is really no choice.
Ok, thanks for clarification. I hope it turns really good in the end.

[TheKobold]

It will still have procedural generation outside of the premade area. So you can have the best of both worlds.

[Wasylus]

TheKobold - that wasn’t the point at all. My point is that no one will work on making the procedural map generation better since all efforts will be focused on making the pre-made areas better. It was about where CDDA development is going in the future and the focus. What you say is correct but irrelevant to that point.
However as Kevin just explained there was no serious work being done with procedural map generation at overmap scale anyway so in practice it won’t change anything in that regard. And the pre-made thing might end really good.

[Wojtek94]

If the state of Massachusetts is based on 1337 overmaps, then Alaska at this same level of detail / scale should provide (approximately) 84000 overmaps. It will be an ENORMOUS world. Another thing to consider- quantity vs quality. Think about Morrowind vs Daggerfall. Daggerfall has a HUGE map which is basically empty af. Morrowind is based on a much smaller world which feels alive. And what about Gothic? Its map is even smaller than Morrowind’s map but it is sooo fun to explore. New map for Cataclysm may be both enormous and realistic / alive

[TheKobold]

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize my input had to completely align with your point. I didn’t know I couldn’t make my own points vaguely based off your own. Especially since Kevin already said your point was moot since procedural generation work has been done for years and no one is planning on working on it.

My apologies for tossing my 2 cents.

[secretfire]

Wow, new mapgen process! Awesome work, guys!

I thought I saw someone a little while back though on the github with a ton of plans for the mapgen stuff, and reorganizing it, and with this huge outline of what they’d like to do. I don’t remember any of the details, but I remember thinking that it would be cool if anything ever came of it. Anyone know what I’m talking about? My memory is foggy.

Even so, this looks cool. I’m amazed at the progress thats already been done with it, though I can’t imagine how complicated the details will be to work out. Great work guys/Kevin/team.

[Wasylus]

If you say so. Whatever floats your boat, man. No need to get personal, I didn’t mean any disrespect to you.
[walks backwards very slowly]

[Trigon]

Ease up a little Wasy. The devs on CDDA are all strictly volunteer. No project takes effort away from another part of the project simply because the “devs” only work on whatever they want to. The people that want to map Massachusetts aren’t necessarily the same people who want to work on the procedural generation code.