6+ months of agonizing "realism" nerfs have ruined this game

[Adventurer]

Honestly, I couldn’t agree more. The moment Crazy Cataclysm was made into a mod I could see the writing on the walls.

[Random_dragon]

Honestly, I couldn’t agree more.

Regarding which of many posts?

[Adventurer]

[quote=“Adventurer, post:141, topic:12504”]Honestly, I couldn’t agree more.

Regarding which of many posts?[/quote]
The subject of the thread.

[TheWumpus]

That you need one to replace a wheel on a very large vehicle, yeah, that’s a problem. Ever see a crane, any kind of large RV, or a backhoe? They all have ways to lift their own wheels off the ground (for stability purposes, but the purpose is irrelevant here). Something like should be easy to implement - in fact, put the same requirements as wheels, and you’ve got a secondary system that makes wheels replaceable. Yay?

I was going to come up with an argument about those being stabilizers to mitigate tipping when loads are moved away from the center line of the chassis, but honestly I see no problem with powered hydraulic rams being a thing. Just a pump that mounts to an engine (which also magically contains the transmission, drive line, and any/all differentials) like an alternator and a wheel end ram attachment. Run the motor, change the wheel. Treat them like another crafting station maybe. In fact to heck with the pump, just run them off batteries.

Hmmm…I’ll have to look into that.

[Findulidas]

I honestly think its quite stupid to say this mod is ruined or controlled by realism when infact it has: zombies that are way more fantastic than the norm, cavemen, triffids, cyborgs, futuristic guns running on rule of cool, unrealisticially awesome uses of everyday weapons, mutagens of several diffrent kinds, magical items, eldritch abominations from other dimensions, scifi labs run by the government in secret everywhere, vaults, random monsters like the thing, you can basically become neo in melee, health system is harsh sure but you can sleep things off, blobs, mycus and all of that, furutistic hostile robots with mininukes, supervehicles, you can learn how to do anything by spending a week reading some books, teleportation and so on… You can also of course quite easily just add a mod with more fantastic stuff and it will work no problem, infact you seem to be more or less encouraged to do so.

All of this makes the game way more fantastic than most games Ive played in the last years.

[hexman]

ok name 1 update they adde onto a new enemy group besides zombie

You mean one group which was added to cataclysm after Whales left??

why did the quote break?

It was due a BBCode-syntax error in FrankPlaysGames’s post.

[StopSignal]

The problem here isn’t that realism is bad. Not at all, after all we live in the real world, where redundantly realism surrounds us, and we know it’s really not bad.
I’m all up to make realism in this game a high point, it’s fun.
The problem is when you try to put realism into the game, and do not actually consider the “game” part.

Most devs don’t have a clue of game design. It’s the truth. They know how to code, and they are awesome at that. They forget to make the new things they add fun though. Or make them even make sense in the game.

Take Dwarf Fortress, the game that will always be the best at what a sandbox simulation can be. In DF, all systems are fun, they are complex enough to let you play with them in a really huge way, and they create the best stories.
“Cats get drunk by licking their paws after they step on booze spills” level of fun. But that game has a design document and only two (i think) developers working on it, with a clear goal in mind. All systems are interconnected. Everything affects another thing, and everything works the way it is supposed to.

But in Cataclysm, being open source, we have more than one thousand different points of view on how the game should be, and all of those people add simulation systems that work only the way they want to and do not interconnect with any other system.

Let’s talk about filthy clothes. It is indeed logical, and i said lots of times before i am in favor of it. It has one major flaw though, it has only one and one way only to clean clothes, with soap and an item that has to be crafted.

Now i have two cats in my home. Having two cats mean i have to clean a lot of cat shit and vomit. And oh i can tell you like ten different ways i have cleaned all of that. Soap, detergent, paper towels, just water, everything basically.

What about filthy clothes in the game where there is indeed towels and detergent and water and even more toxic cleaning products? Oh no, go to the river with a washboard and soap. Sure.

Like Random Dragon said, add realism that adds to the fun and systems and does not go against the idea of realism itself.
Filthy clothes! Realistic! Can’t wash them, only with soap in a river! Unrealistic as hell!

[pisskop]

It does add.

People were outraged by it because it made that gore splattered army helmet unappealing.
Dragon skin vest? You mean dragon skin and peopleguts vest.
Filter mask? okay, if viscera is a filter.

People were not offended by the concept, they were mad they couldnt throw on the zombie clothing (not all of which were terminally damaged) whenever they found one.
Or at least that they would suffer a modest penalty for doing so.

[StopSignal]

[quote=“pisskop, post:148, topic:12504”]It does add.

People were outraged by it because it made that gore splattered army helmet unappealing.
Dragon skin vest? You mean deagone skin and peopleguts vest.
Filter mask? okay, if viscera is a filter.

People were not offended by the concept, they were mad they couldnt throw on the zombie clothing (not all of which were terminally damaged) whenever they found one.
Or at least that they would suffer a modest penalty for doing so.[/quote]

Go to the original topic. People didn’t like how bad the idea was when you wanted to wash the clothes. It just went against all common sense.

[Random_dragon]

People were not offended by the concept, they were mad they couldnt throw on the zombie clothing (not all of which were terminally damaged) whenever they found one.

Or like me, they were annoyed at time and effort being wasted on a feature that, in addition to inconsistent realism, does not contribute to game balance.

[Zilenan91]

Zombie clothes weren’t even that good in the first place and locking them further behind filthiness made no sense

The only zombie who you’d ever actually loot with filthiness was armored zombies for their power armor.

[pisskop]

well no.

early game is why filthiness exists. im not sure if anyone here has ever tried to handwash clothing before. its hard work, and not all that off the mark.

by presoaking clothing you could get the water req down a little, but i nean its not like youre washing sweaty gym socks here.

take a shower victim start, inside a city house. youll see how clothing matters. filthiness is a reason to store clothing away, or use it and dump it. its a reason to drink, and a reason to just not use it.

tweaking filthy clothing should include a residual morale penalty, the restriction of the penalty from plastic/metal clothing, the ability to wipe off metal/plastic clothing, and easier soap access.

[Zilenan91]

That doesn’t make sense though. Making it so you never had to take off zombie clothing by washing it was an exercise in futility since you can usually find or craft something that’s better by the time you can take the time and have the clean water to wash the shitty, likely low-durability zombie clothes.

[pisskop]

being able to magic a duster in 45 minutes is also a mechanic i take issue with, but like filthy clothes i accept its gamey balancing

[matty491]

6+ Months of realism realism nerfs and wandering spawns is still as dodgy as ever. I’d literally give my two legs to the person that buckles down and fixes wandering spawns, once and for all. I still hate the fact it’s impossible to setup a base in wandering spawns because no matter how quiet you are, no matter how silent you are, no matter how clean you smell. The zombies will always find it and will always trash it.

Came back to this game after 2 months of a break and this just reminds me why i stopped in the first place, (3 hours of IRL time) time spent gathering supplies all goes to pot when the zombies invade my base and trash everything.

[Shopkeeper]

Just out of curiosity, where are you trying to base exactly? I’m setup in a farm house leagues from civilization on my current character and have yet to encounter a horde I didn’t explicitly seek out by going to the cities. Which is a far cry from how it used to be on stable.

[matty491]

An evac shelter with city spacing set to 6 and city size set to 3. The evac centre is say about 16 map tiles away from the nearest building so i just dont even know.

I understand the idea of wandering spawns but it seems so stupid to me that there be tonnes of zombies in the centres of a city, I mean surely by this stage of the cataclysm they’ve started ‘Wandering’ so they shouldn’t be so densely packed in the city.

[X-PLODE]

Cities are spawnpoints for hordes.

I don’t even know what problem you’re referring to.

I recommend you build a base in a city and duct tape all the windows and use zombie pheromones to escape detection.

Try setting some buildings on fire or create audio distractions like turning on a car stereo.

And use traps.

Walls are crushed and buildings demolished because each zombie banging on the same structure will multiply the damage effect.

Hulks will punch holes into anything though.

[bitcoinbastard]

[quote=“Zilenan91, post:151, topic:12504”]Zombie clothes weren’t even that good in the first place and locking them further behind filthiness made no sense

The only zombie who you’d ever actually loot with filthiness was armored zombies for their power armor.[/quote]

I washed exactly one piece of filthy clothing, which was an (early game) light amp goggle drop.

[SpadeDraco]

Lol at people still claiming filthy clothes were a "balance change. It’s padding people. Padding to a part of the game that’s already bloated to high hell compared to the rest.