Tips, Tricks, and Newb Questions!

Game Talk The Bunker
12342

[quote=“deoxy, post:12338, topic:42”][quote=“Rot, post:12335, topic:42”]I find it strange when I blast zombs with my Barrett .50 cal they only come out as “damaged” or “Bruised” or something, irl i’m pretty sure they’d be nothing but a fine red mist and pulp at pretty much ANY range.

Then again my katana with 12 melee and 10 cutting with the corresponding martial art can splatter pretty much anything I need.

Game logic.[/quote]

You’ve watched too many movies and not checked enough of the physics of the real world.

A .50 cal can, at best, put a single decent hole in someone. Oh, sure, human life being fragile, it’s quite plenty to cause death in most cases, but for a zombie that doesn’t care about blood loss or any particular organ, it’s kinda meh.

A solid hit with a large cutting weapon can literally cut a person in half. With good modern steel and the right weapon, that could even include the skull.

There’s really no comparison. Ranged weapons haven’t been made more deadly because, against normal humans, they don’t NEED to be.

(No weapon that can be fired while being held by a person is going to have the firepower to “fine red mist” someone - that’s more like the minigun on the A-10, and even then, there’s going to be quite a bit more left than that.)[/quote]

I have said this a few times around here, but I’ll make note of it again. Shooting living targets with a fast moving bullet (.50 is a prime example) makes it so that the kill area is larger, because living targets have such a high H2O ratio. Water does NOT compress, it simply refuses to ever compress under pressure. Because of this a large bullet passing through said water all the water HAS to move. This creates a shock-wave that ripples through the body throwing organs into disarray and causing all kinds of bad things without causing any additional NOTICEABLE physical damage. Called “cavitation” this effect means that even shooting a human/dear/bear/pig etc… only in the intestines and missing the vitals can still result in a kill shot. It does not however liquidate the body (fine red mist) and the innards are still recognizable after the fact. While the bullet and shock-wave would create a “redmist” level of liquidation (solid/gelatinous material such as what makes up the body being turned into such fine particles as to become a “mist”)

To get a “redmist” level of liquidation would likely require 5+ sticks of dynamite worth of explosive shape charged on the body, as (2 1/2?) sticks of dynamite equivalent mostly-shape-charged (partially buried in the ground under body) results in quarter+ sized pieces raining down everywhere (we got rained on apx 120 meters away or so)

So the level of shockwave needed to completely “redmist” a corpse would be in that area, which cannot be accomplished with a carry-able ranged weapon, even if the ammo was explosive core or something.

<.< wow… I am almost scared of myself after writing that… let me put some explanation in here:


So I went out hunting with friends and someone shot a big 200lb+ pig. (boar so no good for eating, unless your taste buds are french and you enjoy the musky taste, or so I’m told [wild boar is delicacy in France]) Someone thought it would be a good idea to…hmm… what was it they thought they were going to accomplish? Blow the pig away? launch it? Whatever. They thought it was a good idea. So we set everything up, digging into the slopped bank a little so we could set the explosive under the boar, but left the side facing us exposed so we could hit it. (exploding rifle target) Then shot it. What followed was not a pretty picture, but certainly removed most of the middle of the pig from the place it was previously. If memory serves, a few dollar coin+ sized pieces fell behind us.

12343

So, what’s the deal with Survivor Cargo Pants/Light Survivor Cargo Pants in the latest experimentals? The latter just seems to totally out class the former in terms of protection for the same level of encumbrance, you would think it’d be the other way around.

Edit: Just to add on to the Barret .50 discussion above. It is possible to explode Zombies into giblets with a modded rifle, high stat/skill level, a precision headshot and critical hit. Heck, if memory serves I’ve gibbed regular Zombies at close range using the .308 round from a SCAR-H with a critical headshot. I think gibbing something is more of a consequence of how damage is handled in CDDA then anything else.

12344

[quote=“deoxy, post:12338, topic:42”][quote=“Rot, post:12335, topic:42”]I find it strange when I blast zombs with my Barrett .50 cal they only come out as “damaged” or “Bruised” or something, irl i’m pretty sure they’d be nothing but a fine red mist and pulp at pretty much ANY range.

Then again my katana with 12 melee and 10 cutting with the corresponding martial art can splatter pretty much anything I need.

Game logic.[/quote]

You’ve watched too many movies and not checked enough of the physics of the real world.

A .50 cal can, at best, put a single decent hole in someone. Oh, sure, human life being fragile, it’s quite plenty to cause death in most cases, but for a zombie that doesn’t care about blood loss or any particular organ, it’s kinda meh.

A solid hit with a large cutting weapon can literally cut a person in half. With good modern steel and the right weapon, that could even include the skull.

There’s really no comparison. Ranged weapons haven’t been made more deadly because, against normal humans, they don’t NEED to be.

(No weapon that can be fired while being held by a person is going to have the firepower to “fine red mist” someone - that’s more like the minigun on the A-10, and even then, there’s going to be quite a bit more left than that.)[/quote]

Have you seen what one of those anti-materiel rifles can do to a deathclaw?

Jokes aside, I forgot to add that I was shooting them at point blank range. (And yes, the red mist thing was added for emphasis, don’t get so worked up about it.)

Still though, I think “A decent sized hole” would be a understatement, as i’m pretty sure a gun meant to punch through armored vehicles several hundred meters away to get to the targets inside would leave even zombies substantially damaged (I.e. pulped/splattered instead of bruised or damaged) when shot.

Point being, a comparison to a rifle that fires a bullet meant to shred through military grade vehicle armor would just as equally (If not several times more) be as powerful as a trained person with a blade at close range.

[quote=“Litppunk, post:12342, topic:42”]I have said this a few times around here, but I’ll make note of it again. Shooting living targets with a fast moving bullet (.50 is a prime example) makes it so that the kill area is larger, because living targets have such a high H2O ratio. Water does NOT compress, it simply refuses to ever compress under pressure. Because of this a large bullet passing through said water all the water HAS to move. This creates a shock-wave that ripples through the body throwing organs into disarray and causing all kinds of bad things without causing any additional NOTICEABLE physical damage. Called “cavitation” this effect means that even shooting a human/dear/bear/pig etc… only in the intestines and missing the vitals can still result in a kill shot. It does not however liquidate the body (fine red mist) and the innards are still recognizable after the fact. While the bullet and shock-wave would create a “redmist” level of liquidation (solid/gelatinous material such as what makes up the body being turned into such fine particles as to become a “mist”)

To get a “redmist” level of liquidation would likely require 5+ sticks of dynamite worth of explosive shape charged on the body, as (2 1/2?) sticks of dynamite equivalent mostly-shape-charged (partially buried in the ground under body) results in quarter+ sized pieces raining down everywhere (we got rained on apx 120 meters away or so)

So the level of shockwave needed to completely “redmist” a corpse would be in that area, which cannot be accomplished with a carry-able ranged weapon, even if the ammo was explosive core or something.

<.< wow… I am almost scared of myself after writing that… let me put some explanation in here:


So I went out hunting with friends and someone shot a big 200lb+ pig. (boar so no good for eating, unless your taste buds are french and you enjoy the musky taste, or so I’m told [wild boar is delicacy in France]) Someone thought it would be a good idea to…hmm… what was it they thought they were going to accomplish? Blow the pig away? launch it? Whatever. They thought it was a good idea. So we set everything up, digging into the slopped bank a little so we could set the explosive under the boar, but left the side facing us exposed so we could hit it. (exploding rifle target) Then shot it. What followed was not a pretty picture, but certainly removed most of the middle of the pig from the place it was previously. If memory serves, a few dollar coin+ sized pieces fell behind us.[/quote]

Cool explanation above. I saw a documentary or somesuch of a solider using a Tac-50 .50 cal rifle which he said he used to split an insurgent in two when said person was planting a roadside IED.

My character has the Niten Ichi-ryū martial art with a katana, 8 dodging, 12+ melee and 10+ cutting with over 20 strength.
Most of the time I splatter targets when I hit them, good for easy disposal, but not so good if you wanted their CBM’s.

My heavily modded Barrett with 9 rifles and 8 marksmanship leaves only single corpses, even at point blank range. I understand my rifle skill is quite low and all, but seriously, this rifle and the caliber is a beast; and I was wondering why isn’t it giving the same splattering result.

12345

I was playing Stable build and everything was fine there(except parasites…). Now i started to play tthe experimental builds but the cold is simply too much. Even if i put on 4 different coats, all of which have at least 50 warmth, stay near a fire and its sunny outside im always freezing to death, at least the counter never changes from -100… I had no such issue in stable build.

Here’s a Screenshot…

http://postimg.org/image/921kmk3g3/

Can someone explain this ?

12346

Just coats? Are other body parts covered? Aside from the eyes, you need warm clothing for all body parts. If that isn’t it, something must be up.

12347

Im playing like 400 expi. Ive noticed that sometimes the game doesnt properly update warmth.

save -> reload?

12348

Appearantly it was a bug, its fixed now.

12349

That is not quite accurate - water WILL compress (ALL matter compresses), but the force required is tremendous, and the compression achieved is very small, so for general purposes, that statement is close enough. Otherwise, your explanation was really great - thanks.

[quote=“Rot, post:12344, topic:42”]Still though, I think “A decent sized hole” would be a understatement, as i’m pretty sure a gun meant to punch through armored vehicles several hundred meters away to get to the targets inside would leave even zombies substantially damaged (I.e. pulped/splattered instead of bruised or damaged) when shot.

Point being, a comparison to a rifle that fires a bullet meant to shred through military grade vehicle armor would just as equally (If not several times more) be as powerful as a trained person with a blade at close range.[/quote]

Actual, a projectile weapon meant to do what you’re talking about can often be LESS lethal to a human (depending on where they are HIT, of course), as the human body is almost indistinguishable from AIR for a projectile like that - goes through like the proverbial hot knife through butter, leaving a relatively small whole and relatively little damage (barring a hit on a vital organ, of course).

The effect is called over penetration. Weapons meant to kill people behave quite differently…

[quote=“Rot, post:12344, topic:42”]My character has the Niten Ichi-ryū martial art with a katana, 8 dodging, 12+ melee and 10+ cutting with over 20 strength.
Most of the time I splatter targets when I hit them, good for easy disposal, but not so good if you wanted their CBM’s.[/quote]

Yeah, when I have Niten Ichi-ryū, I generally try to switch to the wakizashi or even the bokken when I’m trying to get CBMs. When the skills and stats get high enough, I’ll switch to a non-Niten weapon, because even the bokken… yeah, it gets silly.

I don’t know if it’s intended this way, but the light ones have lower storage, so I made one of each and wear the light ones on the outside. Otherwise, yeah, I thought it was mildly odd as well.

[quote=“Newper5, post:12341, topic:42”]Two questions here. First, is there -any- way to use a CVD machine in an ice-lab without freezing to death? Because this is the first CVD I’ve ever seen, but it’s awful cold down there.

Second question! My base is set up on an island in a giant river delta, and it’d be neat to build a boat and travel up and down said river. Is there any way to get a boat past a bridge? I’ve not yet tried, but am hoping someone has an answer before I invest all the resources into assembling one and experimenting.[/quote]

It’s difficult, but layer enough clothes, and you can be warm. Thermal outfits and jedi cloaks are highly useful, but just keep stacking layers (no more than 2 of anything) and you should be able to get there… your encumbrance will be crazy stupid high, though, so make sure you’ve cleared it out first.

I don’t know about bridges (I’d expect not, honestly), but you could check it pretty easily with small boat without a huge time commitment - 3 wooden frames, 3 boat boards, one set of oars - that’s the smallest boat I think you can make (for some reason, 3 is the minimum number of boat boards - anything less will say it’s “leaky” or something) - might need to add a seat, I forget. Disassembling a couple of pieces of furniture would get you enough materials…

12350

Though even munitions meant for warfare have that issue simply because you have to deal with body armor SOMEHOW, and a round that cuts through ceramics like a hot knife through butter tends to go through a human body just as easily.

Anyway, to get us back on topic…haven’t updated experimental build in a while due to various distractions. What are the biggest outstanding bugs that’re still present?

12351

Bugs? I am not sure, I imagine we wan to hit the z-levels mile stone and unfuck npcs a bit more before declaring a new stable.

12352

Que? Never said anything about making a new stable build. >w>

12353

Ah, read that wrong…disregard…

12354

This is rather frustrating, for some reason my Page Up/Down keys are not working in game! They still work outside of DDA, does anyone have any idea why this might be and what I can do to fix it? I’m on Windows 8, this problem just happened out of nowhere. Right now, I can’t get past the Mod Selection tab to start a new game.

12355

Checking the keybinding is my guess.

12356

First thing I tried as well, menu actions aren’t even listed :frowning:

This makes no sense at all, so confusing and frustrating…

12357

I believe you can use the arrow keys, the < and > keys, and TAB to navigate that menu instead. Just to make sure this isn’t a bug, go to your global control options ( in-game: ? => 1 ) and see if you can find anything out if the ordinary there. What version are you using?

12358

Did you check on the help page? That’s where the options are.

12359

Yeah, keybindings on the help screen, don’t see menu options listed. But the <> keys work so that solves that, and page up/down actually still work in game now. Just weird, because I’ve always used the page keys for main menu actions, until now I guess. Something changed in the latest experimental I guess?

12360

i think temperature is broken now, summer, sunny, near ragging fire, scraf and 2 balclawas and bandana, temperature of mouth -50 WTF?

12361

A bug apparently. Are you on the latest build today? Someone said that got fixed recently.