Throwing martial arts

[darktoes]

Yeah, now find me a martial art that includes throwing as a main technique.

Google isn’t a data source.

[VictorSegall]

I never said “main technique”. I used “technique” in the CDDA technical sense. “Tec” in the source code comments.

[Litppunk]

Eh, its the most recently relevent thing I’ve been thinking about, at those levels, were talking taking it into account to hit asprin pills.

What are your thoughts on how to prevent those issues?

Start with a simple post thresh lvl bonus to a newly created precision_bonus, On succesful precision activate weapon_thrown_special. From there it is handled purely by the weapon, and any creature resistances to those. Some weapons can opt to have a precision_fail effects of the same caliber.

Later, or as its added the ability to tip the scales/chance to the players choice, using the characters Precision towards success, or intentional failure (hitting the crasture with the handle/ blunt end) or have 3+ possibles at a later date, if its deeemed desireable. And of coarse could be expanded and tweaked EVEN further, but at that point would likely start to feel like bloat.

…
ugh… if we go the route of advanced throwing being treated as a martial art, then it needs to FEEL different than a martial art, full of auto effects, and if im not mistaken, based almosted exclusively, on having martial arts or not, not the weapon involved (correct me if Im wrong, i’ve not even done more then touch martial arts in-game yet)
And advanced throwing, is more dependent on the item, and the throwers ability to get the desired effect from it.

[Aabbcc]

Apart from my dislike for the double skills just to throw things, for which I have already commented at length, a martial arts approach is inflexible and would be an un-feature as far as playability goes.

The only way it can cope with different effects for different weapons is by changing between martial arts. Not only there’s a delay on ‘always on’ buffs starting up, but having to change martial arts every time you feel like, say, throwing a stick to stun rather than a knife to deal more damage, would get annoying fast.

This would also gate special effects behind books. Since throwing would be presumably nerfed, damage-wise, this would leave throwing as an unviable skill unless you got lucky and found a relevant book.

I never said “main technique”. I used “technique” in the CDDA technical sense. “Tec” in the source code comments.

Find me a martial art who’s throwing weapon technique is in any way special, different in some way to any other skilled individual in the same weapon but not of that martial art, warranting a special effect or bonus.

[VictorSegall]

Already showed a style in which all 4 primary weapons are such, and gave example.

[Litppunk]

Find me a martial art who’s throwing weapon technique is in any way special, warranting a special effect or bonus.

This. This is why Im saying it needs to be handled more on the weapons side of things, and the strength its thrown with.

[Litppunk]

Where? when? What was it? how was it’s throwing any different?

[VictorSegall]

Here, today, Okichitaw.

[darktoes]

I never said “main technique”. I used “technique” in the CDDA technical sense. “Tec” in the source code comments.

Right so… which realworld martial arts have throwing weapon techniques?

Eh, its the most recently relevent thing I’ve been thinking about, at those levels, were talking taking it into account to hit asprin pills.

I guess, if you’re trying to do that from 5 feet away then that’s a neat trick, but it’s not useful in combat.

Already showed a style in which all 4 primary weapons are such, and gave example.

That’s a martial art that uses throwable weapons in melee, it doesn’t include actually throwing weapons.

On throwing weapon special effects, I still think the method I outlined earlier would be the easiest to implement and most intuitive.

[Aabbcc]

No, you showed a martial arts that specializes in four weapons that can be thrown. You have not proved, in any way, that the way it throws those weapons is in any way special.

Someone of that martial art throwing a spear and some dedicated medieval LARP’er are going to throw it the exact same way.

So why is this martial art warranting special effects when it throws weapons? Why would they be different than those that a ninjutsu specialist has? Or one doing medieval fighting?

[darktoes]

Someone of that martial art throwing a spear and some dedicated medieval LARP’er are going to throw it the exact same way.

Hang on, can we add LARP as a martial art? I’m not sure what it would do, but it would be hilarious.

[VictorSegall]

Hang on, can we add LARP as a martial art? I’m not sure what it would do, but it would be hilarious.

It would swing wildly and stumble a lot.

[Litppunk]

Hang on, can we add LARP as a martial art? I’m not sure what it would do, but it would be hilarious.

Agreed, but it would have the same effects on throwing as the throwing arts, which is aparently none.

[VictorSegall]

So why is this martial art warranting special effects when it throws weapons? Why would they be different than those that a ninjutsu specialist has? Or one doing medieval fighting?

Because the art’s training works on the specific weapons, same as with the arts already in.

Greek grappling is also in the Medieval mod. Greece has a sling style.

[Litppunk]

How does the sling style tie in with the martial art its used in, and how would that change anything from a skilled slinger?

[darktoes]

“Way of the Dweeb” Minus 50% to NPC fear levels.

Because the art’s training works on the specific weapons, same as with the arts already in.

Greek grappling is also in the Medieval mod. Greece has a sling style.

Yes but those are for melee, just because you get good at hititng someone with a longbow doesn’t mean you’re good at archery.

[Aabbcc]

facepalm

STOP. EVADING. THE. QUESTION.

What makes the amerindian reenactment throw spears differently than medieval reenactment? Same weapon, different martial arts.
How would a pankration specialist use a sling differently than a caveman reenactor? Same weapon, one doesn’t even have a martial arts.

We can easily provide evidence that different martial arts punch differently, defend differently, use their weapons differently even when they are using the same weapon.

You have yet provided anything that says they throw differently.

[Litppunk]

I would not argue a martial art of the bow after I saw this earlier today when looking into my own tangent. Bows having a martial art would be awesome. Not sure if it would have any effect on SHOOTing the bow other than less penalty for movements before shooting.

You have yet provided anything that says they throw differently.

Please give any evidence that throwing should be handled with martial arts mechanic rather than with calculation of stegth and weapon specials.

[VictorSegall]

How does the sling style tie in with the martial art its used in, and how would that change anything from a skilled slinger?

Greek slinging is specific to slings.

STOP. EVADING. THE. QUESTION.

Stop reasking.

What makes the amerindian reenactment throw spears differently than medieval reenactment? Same weapon, different martial arts.

If you want style specific weapon variants, that’s the easy part. Don’t blame me for your unwillingness to have diverse throwing weapons.

Could have geeked out the same way about swords when there was only a generic sword.

[Aabbcc]

Please give any evidence that throwing should be handled with martial arts mechanic rather than with calculation of stegth and weapon specials.

Err… I’m arguing against the proposal of using a martial arts, from several angles. This is about the second time you’ve quoted me while actually arguing against someone else.

If you want style specific weapon variants, that’s the easy part. Don’t blame me for your unwillingness to have diverse throwing weapons.

Could have geeked out the same way about swords when there was only a generic sword.

So you’re not going to do any work in supporting your argument. Ok. Can we all move on from it then?