General opinion on the new fuel system

[Charlesilv4]

Just wanted to know what the general opinion is about the new system.

Some say it consumes too much, others arent that worried and some ask for better balance.
I didnt played the newst release yet to form my own opinion but i do find interesting to hear people thoughts.

[Shadow86]

I haven’t really been able to test fuel efficiency in several hours of gameplay due to the fact car batteries now require an excessive amount of energy to ignite the engine (over 5%), more than what the overwhelming majority of vehicles spawn with.

So that’s at least one of the issues of the new system.

[Nick_O]

if you play with blazemod on, it’s broken, i think you get like 3% efficiency. 1L of fuel every couple of walking squares. few ingame minutes to run empty.
There is a “fuel deborking” mod to rebalance it if you have blazemod on+new changes, but it’s a temp fix and gasoline seems to going down much faster than before the new changes.

Also new engine system is for light vehicles, anything heavy is broken. so no mobile bases unless you want to cruise with 50-70km/h (diesel traction) or 37km(wankel gasoline) with a 12ton vehicle.

edit: i haven’t tried a vanilla world with no blazemod on. I just applied “fuel deborking” to my existing world, so i can bypass the fuel bug with blazemod and move my mobile base to a better place.(didn’t want to roll back version, for no reason)

edit2: with fuel deborking at least, diesel seems to be faring better than gasoline. Lower consumption but harder to get. Also electric engines can make large vehicles (12tons) go faster than with any available fuel engine. but will need minireactors or lots of solars.

[Charlesilv4]

So its just broken for those that use car mods ?
I dont play with mods, so someone who tested the vanilla version may be able to tell more.

[Aabbcc]

To clarify:
Fuels now have an “energy” stat, blazemod redefined fuels, and since the change was old, it didn’t add back energy, so the fuel went down like crazy. I believe this has been fixed.

Still, without blazemod or any other mod at all, I found the fuel consumption to be significantly higher than before, and the consumption for electric engines to be way too high.

So I just modified the fuel definitions to triple their energy (and put batteries on the same ballpark as the other two fuels), which, for me, is roughly somewhat higher than before the vehicle changes but not by much. That’s the mod being mentioned, btw, which has been added to the experimentals as a mod called huge vehicles.

This modification was done for personal use and the values used were simply ballpark values, they need a lot more testing before I’m 100% happy with them.

[DeclanFrost]

Is multiple engine usage fixed yet? I haven’t gotten around to the new experimentals yet.

Also, since I’m a Noob to this game’s code, how do I debork the fuel consumption?

[BorkBorkGoesTheCode]

Look to Huge Vehicles mod for inspiration. It can be found in data/mods/megaveh

[RedPine]

I do not like the current fuel systems. My LootMobile - a modest one, 5x9 solar roof, only 6 cargo spaces and the basic utilities - lost 20% of it’s gas on a routine looting mission in a moderate sized city. And that was AFTER the battery was completely drained by the electric motor.

I can adjust, I suppose, by using my mobile base as just a base, and doing all looting on a foldable pedal powered vehicle, but IMO making RVs unusable as looting vehicles isn’t very fun.

I haven’t tried a light vehicle yet.

[Greiger]

So far I’m liking it. Fuel lasted way too long. Maybe a realistic amount sure, but it was at the point where a medium size car could play for nearly a year on one tank of gas. Now I actually have to stop to refuel now and then.

Though I probably am the opposite situation as redpine. I stick to lighter cars, usually the biggest car I’ll be satisfied driving around is a standard car. And I usually end up custom building a 3x4 trike by endgame.

Good news is that I hear it can be modded, to change how much power different fuels can give.

Also helpful tip for cars with not enough battery, all you need is a screwdriver to remove and install regular car batteries. You can take one half charged battery from one car and add it as a second battery to one you want to drive. 2 5% batteries tend to be enough to start a car.

[wad67]

I have been grabbing the latest experimental as often as possible, Didn’t really notice the new fuel system at all until the bugs started cropping up.
Not sure if it has been fixed yet, but last time I was playing it was quite difficult to control individual engines.

[Voqar]

I think it sucks and the changes to vehicle speed sucks too. The “breaking” of consumption in blazemod, which per survey, is used by a lot of players, also sucks.

I find this to be another fun reducing, hassle inducing, half assed change to the game.

If you’re going to make fuel consumption higher then you also need to address the fact that not ALL gas stations would be sitting around with less than 50L of fuel combined across all pumps and not ALL vehicles sitting out and about would have 20% or less fuel in them (you find the rare near pristine vehicle in house garages occasionally but it’s equally unrealistic that all of those would be high in fuel).

As stated in other threads on this topic in general, the trend seems to be to add tedium to the game lately. This game is chock full of unrealistic elements (there’s a thread that lists them by the dozen) and this game abstracts a ton of things that make for good and fun gameplay. Selecively applying extreme realism here and there really adds nothing and when it also makes the game tedious and less fun, I question why it keeps getting done (unless as a mod for those few players that like “kick me in the nuts repeatedly” style gaming).

[xironfistx]

worse is that the tedium added does not improve anything.
at least if it could be decent tedium inducing improvements nobody would complain.
for example a tedium inducing change would be modular attachments that are permanent that could be added to clothing,like sewing pouches,sheaths or such to clothing,increasing encumbrance and lowering the durability of the clothing piece modified,so more crafting needed to tailor your clothes to your liking.
but no…
we get the disgusting new inventory system,tedious vehicle nerfs that does not add anything and whatever the evil fuck was dirty clothes.
nevermind the ever broken npcs that warp into your bunkers,depots and forts with their magical ilegal migrant ability to bypass minefields,turrets and fortifications.

[Wyzack]

Personally not a fan of the increased fuel consumption, scavenging for fuel seemed to be at a good level before the change.

Far worse than that though is that every single car barring a very few exceptions do not have enough battery to turn on. This is endlessly frustrating

[hobophobic]

Yeah, I just don’t like how nearly every single vehicle that spawns is disabled in some way. This is one of the only aspects of challenge/difficulty that players currently have no control over. Players should be given a world generation option for vehicles, along the lines of 1-Almost all vehicles won’t start from some reason, 2-50/50 and 3-Most vehicles you run into will start up if you have the skill and a screwdriver to hotwire.

I would take option 2 for my games, but for now, I’ll often just debug spawn a vehicle if I can’t find anything that will run.

[Coolthulhu]

I’m writing some test cases.

How much fuel do we want to be used in what kind of “voyage”?

I’m thinking something like this:
Car (the basic one) accelerating to full and then braking suddenly should be able to offroad a 1 overmap tile like that with one tank full of gas. The constant braking is supposed to simulate going at low velocity, turns etc.
That would be a pretty good stress test that can be automated.

[Lesseps]

So far I didn’t notice any difficulties with finding fuel or working vehicle or consumption.

Since finding a vehicle in working condition is must have step in most playthroughs, I see it perfectly reasonable that you cannot simply jump into first random car and drive off… Why complaining about that God only knows.

And of course this is the good thread to complain about ‘disgusting’ inventory system. Which is actually single best improvement made to the game for a long time. Not to argue here.

[plazma_rush]

Something that might be worth looking into is the efficiency of large vehicles running off of pure solar. The bigger the vehicle, the heavier it is, but the more storage batteries and solar panels you can fit on. How efficient would solar power be on deathmobiles/mobile bases and such?

On a side note, what exactly is meant by the disgusting new inventory system? Aside from (recently) the inventory screen being “windowed” instead of taking up the whole game window, I haven’t noticed anything different.

[Greiger]

Am I seriously the only one who likes the new fuel consumption? Outside of the devs? Vehicles are OP as all hell. They needed a nerf. They are still op but more reasonable now. You should not be able to get a base car, fill it up with gas and be able to drive it around as a lootmobile for a year before you need to refuel.

Want fuel to be stronger? Guess what! It’s defined in a glorified text file now! You can actually change how much energy a unit of fuel is worth now all thanks to the fuel rebalancing. If you don’t like it change it in the json. Before the fuel rebalance if you didn’t like how much fuel you went through you were fucked.

b\Data\json\items[/b] find fuel.json. Open with any text editor like notepad, word, open libre, open office, or MS-DOS Editor. Find “id”: “diesel”. Scroll down to “energy” increase the number next to it as much as you want. do the same for “id”: “Gasoline”. There you go, you ‘fixed’ it.

EDIT: Yes blazemod became broken. That threw me off for awhile too. But that’s what mods do. When a version change happens that significantly modifies core data they depend on, they can will break. Do I think most mods outside the blacklists should be part of the official download? No. You should get those separately. I made a mod, and I considered putting it in with the lists of others that come with the game before coming to the conclusion that bundling mods with the game itself is a bad idea. But hey I’m not a dev.

[Coolthulhu]

Looks like the fuel consumption is broken right now:
There is a giant penalty for going fast. “Optimal” speed is well above actual optimal speed.

[ApatheticExcuse]

If you don’t like it change it in the json. Before the fuel rebalance if you didn’t like how much fuel you went through you were fucked.

That’s kinda the truth, really. It’s like three minutes of work to revert. Once it’s not kinda borked, I probably won’t even have to do that.

EDIT: Yes blazemod became broken. That threw me off for awhile too. But that's what mods do. When a version change happens that significantly modifies core data they depend on, they [s] can [/s] will break. Do I think most mods outside the blacklists should be part of the official download? No. You should get those separately. I made a mod, and I considered putting it in with the lists of others that come with the game before coming to the conclusion that bundling mods with the game itself is a bad idea. But hey I'm not a dev.

The balance mods should also be included, for now. Mostly because they can remove things I don’t really like much that aren’t apparently easy to JSON.

While there’s a bunch of fun other ones currently bundled, it’s not like they’re too hard to find.