Tips, Tricks, and Newb Questions!

[Random_dragon]

Savescumming does at least involve effort though, moreso than debugging. o3o

[Coolthulhu]

Tedium isn’t the kind of effort that should be rewarded or honored in any way.

[Random_dragon]

If that was the case, batch-cooking jerky would reward the player with an armed mininuke. o3o

But still, feels less cheat-y to me than debugging, though Robust Genetics is definitely the better and least-cheat-y option.

[Azrad]

[quote=“BeerBeer, post:8578, topic:42”][quote=“Dlightfull, post:8575, topic:42”]Guys,

so i’ve seen that every mutation path has its own serum, but i can’t find the alpha path serum, which one is that? I have found beast, feline, fish etc., but no alpha.

How do i reliably go the alpha route?[/quote]
Labs are the only place to find mutagen recipes AFAIK, including alpha. If the lack of recipe starts to feel like injustice, then use the debug menu and conjure the recipe document to yourself (whatever the book’s name is). Note that alpha mutagens are notoriously tedious to craft (ingredient hogs), so prepare to debug yourself some ingredients or ready alpha mutagens as well… Also, without the Robust Genetics trait, I wouldn’t mess with mutagens, not even with alphas, at least not without purifiers, and I would only expect 1-2 positive mutations.[/quote]

The Hazardous Waste Sarcophagus should have a standpipe maintenance log, and if I recall among all those logs is the one that hides the elf-a.

[Shopkeeper]

Also, without the Robust Genetics trait, I wouldn’t mess with mutagens, not even with alphas, at least not without purifiers, and I would only expect 1-2 positive mutations.

What? The worst you can get out of Alpha is Fast Metabolism (if have the resources to make Alpha Mutagen you shouldn’t have to worry about your food supply), Nausea (no real effect unless you binge drink and it let’s you vomit on demand if needed) and Weaking (no noticeable effect), those are literally the only negatives. And it gives you a plethora of positive mutations (including Robust Genetics) for a rather reasonable price all things considered. Mutagen is easily batch craftable thanks to Tainted Meat, Bird Eggs are best foraged from forest underbrush for Bird Mutagen, Blob Globs can be found in endless supply in and around Slime Pits, and a Triffid Grove is the perfect place for hunting Plant Marrow for Plant Mutagen. Technically speaking Alpha is the hardest mutation branch to break into due to the price of admission. But unless your looking to Post Threshold in another branch specifically, it’s actually one of the best bases to both finish as and use to cherrypick other mutatations off of.

The path to metahumanity shouldn’t be tedious or reached by cheating and shortcuts, just like everything in CDDA it’s less about the destination and more about the journey, of exciting adventure that you pack up your first mobile home and set out over the horizon for, to get there.

[BeerBeer]

[quote=“BeerBeer, post:8578, topic:42”]Also, without the Robust Genetics trait, I wouldn’t mess with mutagens, not even with alphas, at least not without purifiers, and I would only expect 1-2 positive mutations.

(including Robust Genetics)[/quote]
Ok, you had me sold with that. Personally I find Fast Metabolism annoying as hell due to the frequent need to eat. It’s a hassle, not so much a risk.

So here’s a math question: How many Alpha mutagens does it take to get the Robust Genetics as your first mutation? I assume that statistically, after some number, there’s over 90% chance of (finally) receiving it?

[Shopkeeper]

Once you have Robust Genetics, a dose of Troglobite Mutagen sourced from your local lab will turn Fast Metabolism into Light Eater in no time. Anyway, consulting the wiki for guidance gives us this list of potential mutations from using Alpha Mutagen/Serum.

Pre-Thresh Good: Good Hearing, Robust Genetics, Weak Scent, Pretty, Very Strong, Dextrous, Smart, Very Perceptive

Pre-Thresh Bad: Fast Metabolism, Nausea, Weakening

Post-Threshold: Prime Strength, Prime Dexterity, Prime Intelligence, Prime Perception, Very Little Sleep

That means you have a 1:11 chance right out the gate of getting Robust Genetics with your first dose of Alpha Mutagen. Now obviously there’s a heck of a lot more going on under the hood involving mutations then just statistical chance, I’m nowhere near versed enough in the code to give you an honest answer there, but in the end mutating is equal parts luck and a crapshoot (albeit one which you can tip the balance of in your favor). On my current Alpha character for instance I literally got Robust Genetics as the second to last mutation, Pretty following soon after.

[BeerBeer]

That means you have a 1:11 chance right out the gate of getting Robust Genetics with your first dose of Alpha Mutagen.

That’s not actually true because a character without Robust Genetics is far more prone to getting bad mutations, more accurately 2/3 chance of getting a bad one. Having Robust Genetics flips the odds, to 1/3. That means you first have to pass the 1/3 test of getting a good one. After that it’s 1/8 (from a pool of 8 good mutations). So I guess it’s 1/3 * 1/8 = 1/24. Or about 4% chance. (Sheesh. No wonder I was having such a bad time with mutations in the past.)

The Weakening is no joke. It starts out harmlessly but it gets nasty down the line if it mutates further. I’m not sure if Alpha has the potency to make it worse or if other mutagens are required.

[joxer]

The Weakening is no joke. It starts out harmlessly but it gets nasty down the line if it mutates further. I’m not sure if Alpha has the potency to make it worse or if other mutagens are required.

About weakening, It was one of the very first mutations i’ve got on my path to becoming alpha prime ( Back in 0.B )
By the end of the mutation process having consumed dozens of serums it had still remained as it was ( Did not evolve further )
[sup][sup]( no save-scumming )[/sup][/sup]

[troll_from_behind]

Which MA to pick with stats of 8?
Oh, and a Black Belt.

[joxer]

[quote=“troll from behind, post:8590, topic:42”]Which MA to pick with stats of 8?
Oh, and a Black Belt.[/quote]
short rundown of what i think about the MA’s available from martial arts training

Judo is supposed to be good against opponents that can throw / knock you down
[sup][sup]( not worth 3 starting points imo )[/sup][/sup]
Aikido cripples your damage output and buffs pain generated, supposed to be good against NPC’s
[sup][sup]( not worth 3 starting points imo )[/sup][/sup]

These are special imo, scale based off stats.

Tai Chi - Can’t say i’ve played with it extenssively but it claims to decrease damage based on your perception
Perception being the main stat for those who focus on guns, will provide some extra survivability when you run out of ammo.

Taekwondo - beside the fact you can kick mobs away from you, STR scales the amount of damage you block. worthwhile defensive MA especially if you’re going high STR

Zui Quan - “Drunken boxing” loads of INT scaling, from increased dodge chances to to-hit bonuses after you attack.
I’m quite interested in trying this one out.

Muai Thai - scales based off how strong you are, the damage scales that is.

And ofc Karate, good all-round. nothing new there.

All of these MA’s may be learned through books that spawn in the dojo & in mansions so i wouldn’t typically recommend spending them precious points on em. But if you start blackbelt… Think of your stats

[troll_from_behind]

well it was meant to be a challenge, to choose Black Belt w/out minmaxing the stats to suit your style.
Think it needs to be either ninjitsu or eskrima, the rest, with maybe exception karate/krav maga, are too dependant on high stat or a plain bad.

[joxer]

[quote=“troll from behind, post:8592, topic:42”]well it was meant to be a challenge, to choose Black Belt w/out minmaxing the stats to suit your style.
Think it needs to be either ninjitsu or eskrima, the rest, with maybe exception karate/krav maga, are too dependant on high stat or a plain bad.[/quote]

As black-belt you start with “Martial Arts Training”, Ninjitsu and Krav maga are both in the “self defence” branch,
eskrima is “melee weapon training”…
And that’s not what what black belt is about.

Starting with martial arts training, while certainly it won’t carry you it may easily synnergize with stats for RP and/or playstyle reasons

[troll_from_behind]

To me “martial arts” do include also the arts that employ weapons like kendo and most of martial arts also include weapontraining.
But Holy Dwarven Handshake, Black Belt comes with a FREE style?!
Haven’t really played with it since the time it didn’t come with free style mainly it beign too OP back then.

[joxer]

[quote=“troll from behind, post:8594, topic:42”]But Holy Dwarven Handshake, Black Belt comes with a FREE style?!
Haven’t really played with it since the time it didn’t come with free style mainly it beign too OP back then.[/quote]
The styles in the “Martial Arts Training” branch ( Ones i’ve described ) are hardly worthwhile methinks.
And… as blackbelt you can only chose one of those for free ( Can’t pass up on the offer either )

To me “martial arts” do include also the arts that employ weapons like kendo and most of martial arts also include weapontraining.

Didn’t mean to suggest otherwise, ofc they’re all “martial arts” It’s just that one of the starting traits is bluntly called that.
[sup][sup]anyway as you’ve suggested i do support the notion of all / most martial arts also providing buffs / debuffs to melee. Altho that’d be a pain to lay out and end up as clutter :F[/sup][/sup]

[Dlightfull]

[quote=“joxer, post:8595, topic:42”][quote=“troll from behind, post:8594, topic:42”]But Holy Dwarven Handshake, Black Belt comes with a FREE style?!
Haven’t really played with it since the time it didn’t come with free style mainly it beign too OP back then.[/quote]
The styles in the “Martial Arts Training” branch ( Ones i’ve described ) are hardly worthwhile methinks.
And… as blackbelt you can only chose one of those for free ( Can’t pass up on the offer either )

To me “martial arts” do include also the arts that employ weapons like kendo and most of martial arts also include weapontraining.

Didn’t mean to suggest otherwise, ofc they’re all “martial arts” It’s just that one of the starting traits is bluntly called that.
[sup][sup]anyway as you’ve suggested i do support the notion of all / most martial arts also providing buffs / debuffs to melee. Altho that’d be a pain to lay out and end up as clutter :F[/sup][/sup][/quote]

i think black belt lets you choose muay thai and krav maga too, but i might be wrong

[joxer]

i think black belt lets you choose muay thai and krav maga too, but i might be wrong

double checked, you’re right about muay thai as i’ve said but krav maga isn’t there.
Strange, i’ve always assumed that picking black belt basically locks in “martial arts training” from the traits tab.
but no. the selection is as follows: Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi, Taekwondo, Zui Quan & Muay thai.
whilst martial arts training provides you with: Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi & Taekwondo

ya can hopefully see how i’ve gotten confused about that O.Q
[sup][sup]Cause otherwise i’ve surely made a fool of myself yet again[/sup][/sup]

[Shopkeeper]

[quote=“BeerBeer, post:8588, topic:42”]That’s not actually true because a character without Robust Genetics is far more prone to getting bad mutations, more accurately 2/3 chance of getting a bad one. Having Robust Genetics flips the odds, to 1/3. That means you first have to pass the 1/3 test of getting a good one. After that it’s 1/8 (from a pool of 8 good mutations). So I guess it’s 1/3 * 1/8 = 1/24. Or about 4% chance. (Sheesh. No wonder I was having such a bad time with mutations in the past.)

The Weakening is no joke. It starts out harmlessly but it gets nasty down the line if it mutates further. I’m not sure if Alpha has the potency to make it worse or if other mutagens are required.[/quote]
Well, that’s the math for it. No wonder it took me so long to get Robust Genetics.

But yeah, just using Alpha mutagen won’t turn Weakening into Deterioration or Disintegration. You can only mutate further down the line using Chimera and Elf-A mutagen respectively, don’t think regular mutagen will provoke it either.

[Dlightfull]

[quote=“Dlightfull, post:8596, topic:42”]i think black belt lets you choose muay thai and krav maga too, but i might be wrong

double checked, you’re right about muay thai as i’ve said but krav maga isn’t there.
Strange, i’ve always assumed that picking black belt basically locks in “martial arts training” from the traits tab.
but no. the selection is as follows: Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi, Taekwondo, Zui Quan & Muay thai.
whilst martial arts training provides you with: Karate, Judo, Aikido, Tai Chi & Taekwondo

ya can hopefully see how i’ve gotten confused about that O.Q
[sup][sup]Cause otherwise i’ve surely made a fool of myself yet again[/sup][/sup][/quote]

i don’t see how could you ever be confused about that, it’s a mistery to me.

[BigLie]

The laser pistols and rifle don’t have an ammo supply, thus you can’t reload them. As long as you have at least one charged UPS in your inventory it’ll draw charges/ammunition from it, so you can just take aim and fire.

All you need to do is activate the UPS, I think. In any case, there’s no need to reload the pistol. Just fire away.

Thanks. Worked like a charm.