Throwing martial arts

Please don’t be intentionally difficult to agree with.

Most bows are fairly similar to use, with a few minor exceptions. The overall skills and stances are the most important part, and those are the same for all types. And I think you’re heavily overestimating how much arrows wobble in flight. Once they’ve left the bow they stop seriously wobbling after a few feet.

I guess you’re just wrong then?

Specific throwing weapons then, that still locks high-end throwing behind a book/training.

Also didn’t say that. Specifically disclaimed that misunderstanding multiple times already.

In that case I have no idea what it is you’re actually suggesting. Two separate skills to do the same thing is stupid, so what else are you offering? If you want to discuss this further you really need to make another thread and lay out exactly what it is you’re suggesting.

(this is more of an in-general reply to your last few posts than to this post in particular)

When I first brought up adding special effects to throwing earlier on the thread, as a way to do less damage but retain some usefulness at low levels as a way to shoehorn throwing as a backup skill rather than a primary one, I also brought up a concern with it:

Namely, that some work would need to go into preventing stun-locking and similar issues.

It is also a little tougher than adjusting the damage curve to some desired value, it’s harder to give value to special effects and say how much damage they are worth in compensation, tho this is not an unbeatable task.

What are your thoughts on how to prevent those issues? What should the proc-rate of special effects be, roughly? How it should behave as the skill levels and across weapons?

Me? I am of the thought that ‘early’ weapons such as thrown rocks and sticks would be more ‘disable/delay’, so that low throwing is a backup skill to disable/delay foes before either running away or finishing the enemy with some other weapon, while later weapons like throwing axes would be more killing tools.

Ugh, I agree that such a split would be terrible. It’d be far more natural to unlock the effect at certain skill levels rather than split the skill. If the skill is split weapon-wise, something I’m not convinced there’s enough weapons in the category to justify, then in effect, becoming good enough to do special tricks with weapons of skill A would not give you anything for weapons of skill B.

{
    "type" : "technique",
    "id" : "tec_swordsmanship_grab",
    "name" : "grab",
    "min_melee" : 3,
    "unarmed_allowed" : true,
    "melee_allowed" : true,
    "down_dur" : 1,
    "messages" : [
        "You grab %s",
        "<npcname> grabs %s"
    ]
}
  1. Martial art techniques, applied to throwing weapons.

  2. “throwing” and “throwing weapons” skills jointly influencing throws with throwing weapons, in conceptually the same way that “gun” and “pistol” jointly influence shots with pistols.

Why? What would that achieve? Are you saying there should be a martial art to boost damage with certain throwing weapons? Or add special effects to throwing weapons with that martial art?

Conceptually it’s the same, sure, but it would just be two simple skills building on each other. There are no other skills for either of them to interact with and they both only have a handful of items to work with. It’s intentional overcomplexity for no reason.

I dropped it to just “throwing weapons” in response to Aabbcc’s complaint that there aren’t enough throwing weapons to justify the classification breakdown that guns has.

Yes but it’s still two skills to do one thing, throw items, which means you’re far better off stretching the existing throwing skill, maybe adding special effects at certain levels.

Probably both, yes. That’s how martial arts work, and there’s absolutely nothing strange about it.

Or, maybe we should ask for martial arts to be removed to normalize melee damages.

There’s a big difference between using your whole body in hand-to-hand combat and throwing shit at things. That’s why martial arts exist in real life and “throwing arts” don’t.

Throwing is part of martial arts.

Throwing PEOPLE maybe. Throwing items… Maybe a little bit in a couple of them? I guess you could add a throwing knife bonus to ninjutsu, but having a martial art just for throwing is silly unless you can find a realworld one.

Yeah, now find me a martial art that includes throwing as a main technique.

Google isn’t a data source.

I never said “main technique”. I used “technique” in the CDDA technical sense. “Tec” in the source code comments.

Eh, its the most recently relevent thing I’ve been thinking about, at those levels, were talking taking it into account to hit asprin pills.

Start with a simple post thresh lvl bonus to a newly created precision_bonus, On succesful precision activate weapon_thrown_special. From there it is handled purely by the weapon, and any creature resistances to those. Some weapons can opt to have a precision_fail effects of the same caliber.

Later, or as its added the ability to tip the scales/chance to the players choice, using the characters Precision towards success, or intentional failure (hitting the crasture with the handle/ blunt end) or have 3+ possibles at a later date, if its deeemed desireable. And of coarse could be expanded and tweaked EVEN further, but at that point would likely start to feel like bloat.


ugh… if we go the route of advanced throwing being treated as a martial art, then it needs to FEEL different than a martial art, full of auto effects, and if im not mistaken, based almosted exclusively, on having martial arts or not, not the weapon involved (correct me if Im wrong, i’ve not even done more then touch martial arts in-game yet)
And advanced throwing, is more dependent on the item, and the throwers ability to get the desired effect from it.

Apart from my dislike for the double skills just to throw things, for which I have already commented at length, a martial arts approach is inflexible and would be an un-feature as far as playability goes.

The only way it can cope with different effects for different weapons is by changing between martial arts. Not only there’s a delay on ‘always on’ buffs starting up, but having to change martial arts every time you feel like, say, throwing a stick to stun rather than a knife to deal more damage, would get annoying fast.

This would also gate special effects behind books. Since throwing would be presumably nerfed, damage-wise, this would leave throwing as an unviable skill unless you got lucky and found a relevant book.

Find me a martial art who’s throwing weapon technique is in any way special, different in some way to any other skilled individual in the same weapon but not of that martial art, warranting a special effect or bonus.

Already showed a style in which all 4 primary weapons are such, and gave example.

This. This is why Im saying it needs to be handled more on the weapons side of things, and the strength its thrown with.