# Vehicle Additions Pack (Updated December 8)
**URL:** https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616
**Category:** The Lab
**Tags:** mod
**Created:** [October 19, 2014, 4:12am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616 "2014-10-19T04:12:03Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 16
### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:17pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/301 "2015-09-06T22:17:44Z")
So whatcha think the outputs for the vortex stuff should be?
Looking at the jsons further, the vortex generator needs to be buffed by a factor of 10 or more. You’re never going to have more than one of them installed under normal circumstances, maybe two if you’re awesome, but currently it would take SIXTY of them to equal the power consumption of a single small electric motor. That’s ridiculous.
The vortex engine, I don’t know, I’d like to see it bumped up to being equivalent to a V6 or something. I mean yeah it doesn’t take fuel, but at the same time you have to build it yourself using an exotic component. You can’t just rip one out of any old wreck you pass by.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:20pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/302 "2015-09-06T22:20:11Z")
Hmm. A factor of 10 might be viable, but it depends on the solution. Couldn’t we just make vortex generators work like minireactors by not counting as engines? That way we woudn’t need to buff the output as much because it’d be feasible to install multiple generators.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:26pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/303 "2015-09-06T22:26:56Z")
Blaze tried that and it wouldn’t work. It actually took a change to the base code of the game just to get them to work as engines. For a brief period prior to that they were classed as solar panels since that was the only way to get them to generate power.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/304 "2015-09-06T22:30:38Z")
Whaaaat. We can’t use the classification from minireactors? I’m assuming it’s from the vortex core having an absurdly high power yield?
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:36pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/305 "2015-09-06T22:36:00Z")
There’s no code inherent to the minireactor itself. The game just looks for a container with plutonium, and adds “turn on minireactor” to the vehicle control menu if it finds one.
EDIT: Here’s a link to the part of this thread from April where it was being discussed:
[http://smf.cataclysmdda.com/index.php?topic=8060.msg231121#msg231121](http://smf.cataclysmdda.com/index.php?topic=8060.msg231121#msg231121)
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 10:59pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/306 "2015-09-06T22:59:01Z")
Ah. Damned hardcoded stuff. ;w;
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/307 "2015-09-06T23:48:43Z")
I’m fishing for numbers I can plug into my current json and not feel like I’m cheating. I’ll tell you what, what if buff each by 10x and let you know how it gets along with my stupidly uber deathmobile. Then it’s not cheating, it’s testing.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2015, 11:50pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/308 "2015-09-06T23:50:14Z")
Or step it up a given amount at a time and see what the lowest desirable multiplier is.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 1:05am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/309 "2015-09-07T01:05:00Z")
I’ll consider 10x a reasonable first step on the generator. That’s still only an input equivalent to one-sixth the drain of a small electric motor. Desirable, but hardly seeming to represent endless power. The engine I’ll dial up by 5x. Being as it requires an engame type of component and some crafting, I’d like it to make it viable as the only engine for a large vehicle.
This also makes both values 1000, which is oddly really appealing to me. lol
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 1:08am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/310 "2015-09-07T01:08:41Z")
Yes. Dooo iiiit.
Also tempted to PR some things for Boatmod, namely changing oars to serve as controls, setting oars to need to tools to install, and making boat boards nailable.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 3:35am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/311 "2015-09-07T03:35:32Z")
So with the power set to 5x and crammed into a 27,000 pound roller drum deathmobile, the vortex engine gives speeds of 85/799. (By comparison a 15.99 liter V12 gives speeds of 82/1247.) I’m pretty okay with that, but it’s simple enough to tweak to taste.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 3:37am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/312 "2015-09-07T03:37:25Z")
_cue Mr. Burns impression_ Excellent.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 5:19am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/313 "2015-09-07T05:19:58Z")
Even with a 10x buff, the vortex generator puts out less epower than a car alternator, and not even half the power of a truck alternator. I’m changing the output of the vortex generator to 2238, the same exact amount the truck alternator and plasma engine produce.
As for the vortex engine, I’ve lowered its power from 1000 to 800. This lowers the speed of my 27,000 pound vehicle from 85/799 down to 68/639. That makes it notably less powerful than a large V12, but still powerful enough to get a behemoth vehicle up to a very respectable cruising speed.
These seem like pretty good values to me. The generator is just a truck alternator that runs on nothing, and the engine is a bitch to craft and not the strongest in the game, but never needs to be fueled. Desirable, but not world shattering.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 6:11am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/314 "2015-09-07T06:11:18Z")
Hmm. Seems acceptable, though could go with a value in-between car and truck alternators.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 6:27am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/315 "2015-09-07T06:27:39Z")
Hmm. That does make sense, true. In any case, pondering Boatmod stuff while waiting for another PR to get checked by the bot.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 6:32am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/316 "2015-09-07T06:32:26Z")
Sorry, just deleted my post to rephrase myself since I thought my language was clunky. Let me restate myself for posterity and anyone else who wanders by.
I think giving the vortex generator the same power as the best alternator is just about right. For all intents and purposes, vehicles have a total of two engine slots. That means that if you’re using conventional engines, you can install two gasoline engines and two alternators.
But with the vortex items, you can only have one of each. This is because the vortex generator takes up one of your precious engine slots, while an alternator does not.
This means that a conventional dual-engine gasoline setup will vastly outperform any possible vortex setup, even if everything else is equal. Suddenly that thing where the generator eats up an engine slot isn’t a nuisance, it’s a balancing feature.
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 6:51am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/317 "2015-09-07T06:51:50Z")
> [@Random\_dragon](#):
>
> Hmm. That does make sense, true. In any case, pondering Boatmod stuff while waiting for another PR to get checked by the bot.
I always wanted to build an amphibious deathmobile where I could swap wheels for boat boards on the fly and keep the wheels in storage. Would driving into shallow water and then making the swap work?
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 6:53am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/318 "2015-09-07T06:53:55Z")
I oughta eat you for making me retroactively double-post. \<3
And yeah, makes sense. Then again…does the vortex engine ever burn out power or battery? If you don’t need a vortex generator just to drive then this is at least an issue one can adapt to. Would only really need enough alternative sources of battery power for other devices added to the vehicle, and everyone loves solar panels…
> [@Thwap](#):
>
> [quote=“Random\_dragon, post:315, topic:7616”]Hmm. That does make sense, true. In any case, pondering Boatmod stuff while waiting for another PR to get checked by the bot.
I always wanted to build an amphibious deathmobile where I could swap wheels for boat boards on the fly and keep the wheels in storage. Would driving into shallow water and then making the swap work?[/quote]
Far as I know, I’ve yet to work out how to add/remove vpart flags on command. This is just a few tweaks to existing parts: [https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/13512](https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/13512)
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### Author:  [@Thwap](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Thwap)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 7:25am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/319 "2015-09-07T07:25:45Z")
> [@Random\_dragon](#):
>
> Then again…does the vortex engine ever burn out power or battery? If you don’t need a vortex generator just to drive then this is at least an issue one can adapt to. Would only really need enough alternative sources of battery power for other devices added to the vehicle, and everyone loves solar panels…
You can double up and use two vortex engines, but that will only make you roughly equal to the gasoline vehicle in terms of speed. In exchange for that your engine slots will be generating zero electricity. Meanwhile the gasoline vehicle will have two truck alternators, each of which is roughly equal to 10 upgraded solar panels.
And the vortex items take serious crafting and an exotic component from the bottom of a mine. The gasoline stuff you can find lying in the road.
Really there wouldn’t even be much of a reason to go with double vortex engines. You don’t really need to go 200 miles an hour or whatever.
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### Author:  [@Random\_dragon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Random_dragon)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2015, 7:29am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/vehicle-additions-pack-updated-december-8/7616/320 "2015-09-07T07:29:07Z")
True. As much hassle as it is to craft, remember that this is effectively free to run once setup. Question is whether that benefit warrants being both hard to craft AND being less effective, or whether it just has to be difficult to obtain and craft.
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