# The Art & Science of Chemical Warfare for Survivors: Chlorine Gas, Phosgene, & Sulfur Mustard

**URL:** <https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876>\
**Category:** The Drawing Board\
**Created:** [December 12, 2018, 3:41pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876 "2018-12-12T15:41:56Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 19\
**Page:** 2

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**Author:** ![Ricky\_Van](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ricky_van/32/4666_2.png) [@Ricky\_Van](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Ricky_Van)\
**Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 11:38pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/21 "2018-12-12T23:38:49Z")

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oohh okay… this just reminds me…

how many gas-based danger in the game?

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**Author:** ![nameless\_survivor](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/nameless_survivor/32/4476_2.png) [@nameless\_survivor](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/nameless_survivor)\
**Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 11:42pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/22 "2018-12-12T23:42:01Z")

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If you see anything gaseous, its bad for you. And don’t go near fungus without a gas mask either.

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**Author:** ![Ricky\_Van](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ricky_van/32/4666_2.png) [@Ricky\_Van](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Ricky_Van)\
**Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 11:43pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/23 "2018-12-12T23:43:47Z")

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oohh… that’s good. i forget the gas on fungus and some place with leaking gas.

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**Author:** ![Sanehatter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c57346/32.png) [@Sanehatter](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Sanehatter)\
**Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 10:57pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/24 "2018-12-13T22:57:39Z")

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Even if high concentrations are needed, smoking the ants inside a nest (thus killing the queen) is still pretty possible.

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**Author:** ![TheZoneWizard](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/thezonewizard/32/1397_2.png) [@TheZoneWizard](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/TheZoneWizard)\
**Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 1:49pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/25 "2018-12-14T13:49:51Z")

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If we had NPCs that could make use of a rifle. I would be pretty leary about rushing into a room with them.

I would prefer to gas people out of the building. That or if we had smart NPCs, I would also light the building on fire and make them run outside to inspect and/or flee from a burning building for a stealth approach tactic.

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**Author:** ![Darkfirephoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7993a0/32.png) [@Darkfirephoenix](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Darkfirephoenix)\
**Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 2:48pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/26 "2018-12-14T14:48:21Z")

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How to easily take out anything that is vunerable to CO (Carbon-monoxide), dump a load of coal in a closed room (like sealing off any entrances/exits to a ant-nest) and then dump water on it. Wait a while, ???, PROFIT.

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**Author:** ![Sanehatter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c57346/32.png) [@Sanehatter](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Sanehatter)\
**Post date:** [December 15, 2018, 5:30pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/27 "2018-12-15T17:30:03Z")

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The ant nests in game seem to have fairly large entrances tho. It would take a considerable construction project to seal it.

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**Author:** ![redxlaser15](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/redxlaser15/32/1573_2.png) [@redxlaser15](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/redxlaser15)\
**Post date:** [December 15, 2018, 6:42pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/28 "2018-12-15T18:42:50Z")

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Pfft, all you need is a giant cork and problem solved! Do you not watch TV or something?

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**Author:** ![Darkfirephoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7993a0/32.png) [@Darkfirephoenix](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Darkfirephoenix)\
**Post date:** [December 15, 2018, 6:49pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/29 "2018-12-15T18:49:18Z")

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Or a big (giant) steel plate (or a vehicle) to park over the anthill and cover the exit

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**Author:** ![nameless\_survivor](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/nameless_survivor/32/4476_2.png) [@nameless\_survivor](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/nameless_survivor)\
**Post date:** [January 25, 2019, 4:46pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/30 "2019-01-25T16:46:42Z")

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> [@kevin.granade](#):
>
> The only thing on the list that seems like it would work on ants would be Carbon Monoxide in very high concentrations, though there are many, many other options for that, though the quantities needed may be problematic.

I was looking up something unrelated, and had an interesting idea. Besides scavenging from stores for insecticides, survivors should be able to manufacture DDT with the correct chemistry knowledge and a chemistry bench. A few other specialized tools might be needed as well, but they could be manufactured by the player. From what I’ve been reading DDT kills insects and arachnids, and a good chunk of the Arthropoda phylum in general. The precursors can be synthesized with simple laboratory equipment that a chemistry bench would have, and a few metal catalysts like copper, platinum, etc.

Ought to work well on giant bugs and spiders. Its not like the ecosystem isn’t already fucked in the long-term in the first place, and small scale usages won’t be nearly as deleterious to the food chain as mass dispersal on farms and in cities for pest control.  
[DDT - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDT)  
The first ingredient precursor, Chloral, is manufactured in a two stage process from hydrochloric acid, sulfuric acid and Acetaldehyde: [Chloral - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloral)  
The Acetaldehyde can be made several ways, such as the partial dehydration of ethanol, or hydration of acetylene: [Acetaldehyde - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetaldehyde#Production)

The other ingredient, Chlorobenzene, is trickier, but can be done several ways, though it may require metal catalysts and some home made apparatus, like a miniature reaction vat or something: [Benzene - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzene#Reactions)  
[Chlorobenzene - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorobenzene)

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**Author:** ![Invalid\_Username](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4bbf92/32.png) [@Invalid\_Username](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Invalid_Username)\
**Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 9:44am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/31 "2019-01-26T09:44:38Z")

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You might be surprised at what you can make in your garage with the right materials and lab equipment. Mustard gas is for scrubs. Protip: don’t do this you’ll be arrested or probably kill yourself

 ![1467198119323](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/cataclysmdda/original/2X/4/4ffebdef51dd49781c7188d0492681943e3d7e71.png)

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**Author:** ![nameless\_survivor](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/nameless_survivor/32/4476_2.png) [@nameless\_survivor](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/nameless_survivor)\
**Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 1:45pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/32 "2019-01-28T13:45:22Z")

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> [@Invalid\_Username](#):
>
> You might be surprised at what you can make in your garage with the right materials and lab equipment.

Yep. With the right knowledge, tools, and resources you can make anything that does not require microscopic level detail (microchips for example) in your garage. I remember reading somewhere that back in the 1950’s or so some high school students and their physics teacher built a fission bomb (minus the plutonium and explosive initiators) as a class project. They gave it to the army which added the fissile material and successfully detonated it.

> [@Invalid\_Username](#):
>
> Mustard gas is for scrubs.

My biggest issues with a survivor trying to manufacture nerve agents is primarily the difficulty of finding all the precursor ingredients in the quantities you would need. Having the capability to make VX nerve gas or something similar is useless if you have to scour the entire state just to find enough of the precursors to make a single gas grenade.

That is the biggest advantage of sulfur mustard and the other poison gases I mentioned: they can all be synthesized, relatively simply, from common household chemicals and other materials.

The near-suicidal danger of the synthesis process for nerve agents is also a consideration. You would have to be crazy or desperate (or both) to make any of that stuff by hand.

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**Author:** ![Invalid\_Username](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4bbf92/32.png) [@Invalid\_Username](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Invalid_Username)\
**Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 2:56am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/33 "2019-01-29T02:56:22Z")

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> [@nameless\_survivor](#):
>
> My biggest issues with a survivor trying to manufacture nerve agents is primarily the difficulty of finding all the precursor ingredients in the quantities you would need.

Survivors regularly stumble across laboratories full of technomagical goo that horrifically and rapidly changes your genome. What’s more surprising is that they DON’T have any anhydrous ammonia and suchlike. Unless you’re thinking of irl survivors, in which case yeah, that would be a royal bitch and a half. True enough about the Home Depot materials, too.

> [@nameless\_survivor](#):
>
> You would have to be crazy or desperate (or both) to make any of that stuff by hand.

Some would also say that one would have to be crazy or desperate to let a machine shove metal into their skull while unconscious, or to inject a syringe full of the aforementioned goo into themselves.

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**Author:** ![Turtleoverlord](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/turtleoverlord/32/5193_2.png) [@Turtleoverlord](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Turtleoverlord)\
**Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:20pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/34 "2019-02-02T18:20:22Z")

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Mustard gas affects your cells in a horrible way the zombies are basically Shells for the blob this means that the gas could destroy the body and probably the blob,BUTT THE WIND TURNS THE GAS AGAINST YOU

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**Author:** ![Ricky\_Van](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ricky_van/32/4666_2.png) [@Ricky\_Van](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Ricky_Van)\
**Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 8:17pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/35 "2019-02-02T20:17:51Z")

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i would like to see an ability for the player to use some kind of mortar launcher to launch a canister filled with corrosive gas… would be something from WW2.

or using grenade launcher…

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**Author:** ![Turtleoverlord](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/turtleoverlord/32/5193_2.png) [@Turtleoverlord](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Turtleoverlord)\
**Post date:** [April 2, 2019, 3:43pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/36 "2019-04-02T15:43:39Z")

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Well,I just want to see a MI-GO get stoned from a mustard gas

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**Author:** ![Mr.Denton](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/mr.denton/32/3156_2.png) [@Mr.Denton](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Mr.Denton)\
**Post date:** [April 2, 2019, 6:46pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/37 "2019-04-02T18:46:46Z")

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That was quite a indebt guide to making deadly gasses…

Well you learn something new everyday

Don’t try at home folks

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**Author:** ![Turtleoverlord](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/turtleoverlord/32/5193_2.png) [@Turtleoverlord](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Turtleoverlord)\
**Post date:** [April 2, 2019, 7:59pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/38 "2019-04-02T19:59:18Z")

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FBI wants to know your location

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**Author:** ![nameless\_survivor](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/nameless_survivor/32/4476_2.png) [@nameless\_survivor](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/nameless_survivor)\
**Post date:** [April 4, 2019, 4:28pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/the-art-science-of-chemical-warfare-for-survivors-chlorine-gas-phosgene-sulfur-mustard/17876/39 "2019-04-04T16:28:20Z")

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A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. A _lot_ of knowledge is a REALLY dangerous thing.

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