So... Martial Arts

DG123 · 2013-09-04T21:27:48.000Z

I was going to suggest putting in Silat, the martial art that makes use of any weapon to hand.

But it seems you already addressed weapon use.

Mrnocamera · 2013-09-04T22:53:12.000Z

You used YOLO. I shall… Download… DAMN YOU, WEAKNESS TO AWESOME SOUDING THINGS!

KA101 · 2013-09-04T22:57:38.000Z

Thoughts:

Different MA styles ought to have some loss when shifting. Akido & Judo might get along OK–I think–because both seem to involve grabs, throws, etc, but going from either to Centipede Style (kung fu) ought to be a stretch. Things like that.

1A) Thinking maybe have styles related on axes: Sport/Combat and Strike/Grab, for instance, based on the various movesets and whether the style was designed for tournaments, actual fighting, or somewhere in between. Closer-relates styles can be generalized between more easily?

Wrestling ought to be a style, learnable from from the 101 Wrestling Moves. Seems like a Sport, since you’d be trained not to actually kill your opponent, but probably a decent split between strikes and grabs.

GlyphGryph · 2013-09-05T12:39:57.000Z

I like this quite a bit, and am made happy with the fact that someone apparently came up with an independent implementation for martial arts that so similar to what I wanted to do myself. I support this getting mainlined, and I support trashing all the existing martial arts to do so, since most of them are useless anyway.

This isn’t to say there aren’t plenty of changes I’d like to make to it - I’m sure swwu has at least a few as well - but it’s a system that provides a damn good foundation moving forward, so awesome.

swwu · 2013-09-05T15:27:27.000Z

Okay, a brief update. I’ve implemented karate, aikido, judo, tai chi, capoeira, krav maga in the new system, and am currently experimenting with moving techniques and diseases into JSON, since I feel now is as good of a time as any to do that. This will slightly change the martial arts JSON but that should be okay. Techniques are gonna have flags that define which goals they can fulfill (like in #1565) and the goals can go in later.

gammaflux · 2013-09-14T13:26:12.000Z

So I’m not sure this is the best place to put this but, maybe you could add a street fighter style. It could add a minimal amount of damage and possibly allow you to get a free hit in (15% chance?), with the damage equal to your unarmed + (1/2 melee) skill level. You could unlock it at let’s say level 10 unarmed, without learning it from any Npc. (You could also add a trait/profession that allows you to start off with it). Of course this style would be the worst style ever, but later on it could evolve into a decent style.

Which is why maybe at unarmed level 20-30 it would change from Street Fighting too Personal Style (Give yourself a cookie if you catch the reference) “Personal Style” would be like Street Fighting Alpha Plus. Allowing you to get bonuses/special attacks dependent on your “BASE” stats. (A low stat could give you a small bonus while a higher stat would completely replace the bonus with stronger skills/abilities) Also upon receiving “Personal Style” you could rename it to whatever you want. (For fun)

Also I’d like to say that I like what the OP of this thread is doing with the current combat system. It seems pretty awesome and cool.

Sidenote: (maybe you could advance Centipede Style ----> Millipede Style) Once you get enough levels in the unarmed skill.
You could even change Muay Thai ----> Muay Thai Boran (A very brutal style and the predecessor to Muay Thai (Muay Thai is a very watered down version of it.))

An alternative to reach this is allowing the game to catalog how many kills you’ve achieved with each style. And at a certain amount of kills with said style it could evolve into it’s ultimate form.

Oh, and I almost forgot. You could also allow Judo users to have a special ability to pick up enemies and throw them into other enemies/terrain rather than just knocking them back a space. (The damage/range would be dependent on your throwing skill, strength, and enemy size/weight)

Now unfortunately I don’t know how hard this would be to implement. (I’m no coder) But if these were considered I’d be content.

So do any of you have any thoughts about this?

Zireael · 2013-09-15T09:24:10.000Z

This is awesome! I’ll be sure to make a MA char once this gets mainlined.

swwu · 2013-09-18T16:40:41.000Z

Okay, I’m opening a pull request with the techniques/styles broken out into JSON, and the buffs system. I added a bunch more fields to the buffs JSON too (although the “documentation” above hasn’t yet been updated). I unfortunately haven’t had a chance to implement more than the 5 “basic” martial arts, so for now the other martial arts traits have been disabled. It should be much easier to implement more martial arts going forward though, since they can now be done in purely JSON. Lots of other notes in the PR: https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/3104.

gammaflux:

So I’m not sure this is the best place to put this but, maybe you could add a street fighter style. It could add a minimal amount of damage and possibly allow you to get a free hit in (15% chance?), with the damage equal to your unarmed + (1/2 melee) skill level. You could unlock it at let’s say level 10 unarmed, without learning it from any Npc. (You could also add a trait/profession that allows you to start off with it). Of course this style would be the worst style ever, but later on it could evolve into a decent style.

You should be able to do something like this yourself once it gets mainlined. Your style when using no style is “style_none” (which is defined in the JSON), which can actually have buffs/techniques/whatever just like any normal style can.

kevin.granade · 2013-09-18T16:51:00.000Z

Cool! I probably would have nabbed it directly from your branch if you’d put off making a PR much longer, only thing stopping me was recovering from the 0.8 release <_<

swwu · 2013-09-19T10:15:34.000Z

Cool. I’m merging it with each new daily build right now but it’s kind of a pain since there are some fairly extensive changes, so there are always a lot of merge conflicts. Looking forward to seeing this go in though.

GlyphGryph · 2013-09-20T20:28:36.000Z

The sooner you merge it in the less work you have to do to keep it up.

Have you made the PR yet?

swwu · 2013-09-21T20:28:11.000Z

Yep, made a PR. Kevin had some concerns with it that I’m polishing up and then (I imagine) it will be mainline-ready.

UberZacht · 2013-09-21T20:37:22.000Z

Wow, I just made a post that related to this topic, and if this gets integrated with the game, would have solved the problem I had addressed. This is really cool, I love using Martial Arts, having a category of Weapon Martial Arts would be cool (e.g. Iaido, Kendo, Sojutso, etc.). I would like some actual wrestling styles, like standard Olympic Wrestling and Sumo. Ya Know?

Mrnocamera · 2013-09-22T07:17:41.000Z

Kendo with katanas. Zombies gonna be smacked.

Rivet · 2013-09-22T07:24:53.000Z

Oh weapon styles!

Perhaps we can get some ARMA stuff eventually.

I’d love to have some proper European martial art forms in order to handle my große Schlachtschwert with a degree of competence.

Tally · 2013-09-22T08:07:15.000Z

Along these lines, I don’t see anything wrong with implementing untrained tactics ‘styles’ that you start with by default. Think the tactics feature of ADOM but somewhat more elaborate. I should think that a basic tactic ‘style’ should be mostly stripped down, i.e. a mild passive effect only, or a block in highly defensive tactics.

swwu · 2013-09-22T11:49:54.000Z

Okay, we’re merged into mainline. Should be tryable in experimental builds soon.

KA101 · 2013-09-22T21:13:42.000Z

[quote=“Rivet, post:22, topic:2930”]Oh weapon styles!

Perhaps we can get some ARMA stuff eventually.

I’d love to have some proper European martial art forms in order to handle my große Schlachtschwert with a degree of competence.[/quote]

Oh–were you the one who linked Knight v. Samurai? Thanks!

(Even though the author was getting a bit pushy there, the essays are worthwhile.)

Rivet · 2013-09-22T21:25:08.000Z

Yeah the author’s massive ego really shows through in that article but it still made a very good point about the different ways the two cultures approach their martial arts, or fancy armed dance routines, as the case may be.

xLemor · 2013-09-24T02:36:58.000Z

Good article and its a shame that they couldnt do it
It would be very interesting to watch but said “masters” didnt want to spar amateurs?
What a deception, i always admired japanese martial arts and now im not so sure… its not supposed to be just for shows and flashy manuvers but i guess thats how they turned it into. So much for the warrior’s spirit crap…