# New FUN trait: Careless

**URL:** <https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771>\
**Category:** The Drawing Board\
**Created:** [June 14, 2013, 10:22pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771 "2013-06-14T22:22:20Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [June 14, 2013, 10:22pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/1 "2013-06-14T22:22:20Z")

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Gives 2 (maybe 3?) points, removes “Would you really like to…? Y/N” movement prompts.  
Oh boy!

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**Author:** ![Verdigriss](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Verdigriss](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Verdigriss)\
**Post date:** [June 14, 2013, 10:56pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/2 "2013-06-14T22:56:05Z")

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Might be a good idea. You should probably also lose the option to use safe mode.

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**Author:** ![DWC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f19dbf/32.png) [@DWC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DWC)\
**Post date:** [June 14, 2013, 11:13pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/3 "2013-06-14T23:13:36Z")

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I like this idea, I think being really drunk or high should replicate that effect too.

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**Author:** ![ted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@ted](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/ted)\
**Post date:** [June 14, 2013, 11:29pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/4 "2013-06-14T23:29:31Z")

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This is a terrible idea. The game shouldn’t reward you for using an inferior interface.

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**Author:** ![detahramet](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/detahramet/32/58_2.png) [@detahramet](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/detahramet)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/5 "2013-06-15T01:02:33Z")

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Why’s that?  
Its a negative trait that would make the game more difficult, and thus gives you Creation Points to balance this out.

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/6 "2013-06-15T01:31:49Z")

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Think of it as Hardcore Light. Or OCD Premium.

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**Author:** ![ted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@ted](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/ted)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 1:34am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/7 "2013-06-15T01:34:05Z")

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The bar for a trait needs to be higher than just giving you some points and making the game harder. A good trait should make the game more fun by bringing different strategies to the forefront, and should have an benefit roughly proportionate with the points cost; this trait gives you points without impacting your strategy at all, as long as you’re able to play marginally more carefully around traps.

Would anyone want to lose movement warnings if they didn’t get points for doing so?

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 1:37am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/8 "2013-06-15T01:37:14Z")

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> [@ted](#):
>
> Would anyone want to lose movement warnings if they didn’t get points for doing so?

It’d be a choice, just like Hardcore.

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**Author:** ![ted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@ted](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/ted)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 1:56am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/9 "2013-06-15T01:56:08Z")

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It’s not actually like Hardcore, because hardcore has at least some novelty value in making a bunch of normally survivable things deadly, and forcing you to adopt super-cautious strategies that avoid damage at all costs. Careless just demands that you issue movement commands more deliberately around traps. Your actual strategy is not affected one iota.

If I believed some players actually preferred the lack of movement warnings, I would support adding it as an option in the options menu. If you truly want to play without movement warnings, shouldn’t that be enough?

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**Author:** ![DWC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f19dbf/32.png) [@DWC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DWC)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 2:06am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/10 "2013-06-15T02:06:37Z")

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Traps, fire, moving vehicles. Plenty of room for mishaps by removing the y/n prompt and it replicates somebody silly enough to step in their campfire or jump out of a moving vehicle, since players would do this all the time without the prompt.

It’d definitely be worth a point or two to have the prompts if they were disabled by default.

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**Author:** ![ted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@ted](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/ted)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 2:30am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/11 "2013-06-15T02:30:56Z")

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[quote=“DWC, post:10, topic:1771”]Traps, fire, moving vehicles. Plenty of room for mishaps by removing the y/n prompt and it replicates somebody silly enough to step in their campfire or jump out of a moving vehicle, since players would do this all the time without the prompt.

It’d definitely be worth a point or two to have the prompts if they were disabled by default.[/quote]

Players aren’t that stupid; they can condition themselves to avoid these mishaps pretty well if necessary. But it should not be necessary; the computer does it perfectly. The trait gives the player the choice between mechanical efficiency and interface hassles, which should never be done.

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**Author:** ![KA101](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/278dde/32.png) [@KA101](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/KA101)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 2:32am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/12 "2013-06-15T02:32:52Z")

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[quote=“DWC, post:10, topic:1771”]Traps, fire, moving vehicles. Plenty of room for mishaps by removing the y/n prompt and it replicates somebody silly enough to step in their campfire or jump out of a moving vehicle, since players would do this all the time without the prompt.

It’d definitely be worth a point or two to have the prompts if they were disabled by default.[/quote]

Currently, Cata’s a fairly decent roguelike by my standards: it doesn’t get all jagoff-y about letting the player do things they wouldn’t want to do, via interface mishaps. I’d hate to lose that, so this trait and especially this idea (having it be the default) worries me. ☹

Re silly/conditioning: player fatigue, distraction, etc can also apply. Not everyone has the ability to play Cata under idea conditions.

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**Author:** ![AerialK7](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@AerialK7](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/AerialK7)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 2:36am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/13 "2013-06-15T02:36:04Z")

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[quote=“KA101, post:12, topic:1771”][quote=“DWC, post:10, topic:1771”]Traps, fire, moving vehicles. Plenty of room for mishaps by removing the y/n prompt and it replicates somebody silly enough to step in their campfire or jump out of a moving vehicle, since players would do this all the time without the prompt.

It’d definitely be worth a point or two to have the prompts if they were disabled by default.[/quote]

Currently, Cata’s a fairly decent roguelike by my standards: it doesn’t get all jagoff-y about letting the player do things they wouldn’t want to do, via interface mishaps. I’d hate to lose that, so this trait and especially this idea (having it be the default) worries me. ☹

Re silly/conditioning: player fatigue, distraction, etc can also apply. Not everyone has the ability to play Cata under idea conditions.[/quote]

Hey, you’re the one that SAID you wanted to eat that active mininuke!

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![KA101](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/278dde/32.png) [@KA101](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/KA101)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 2:45am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/14 "2013-06-15T02:45:54Z")

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[quote=“AerialK7, post:13, topic:1771”][quote=“KA101, post:12, topic:1771”][quote=“DWC, post:10, topic:1771”]Traps, fire, moving vehicles. Plenty of room for mishaps by removing the y/n prompt and it replicates somebody silly enough to step in their campfire or jump out of a moving vehicle, since players would do this all the time without the prompt.

It’d definitely be worth a point or two to have the prompts if they were disabled by default.[/quote]

Currently, Cata’s a fairly decent roguelike by my standards: it doesn’t get all jagoff-y about letting the player do things they wouldn’t want to do, via interface mishaps. I’d hate to lose that, so this trait and especially this idea (having it be the default) worries me. ☹

Re silly/conditioning: player fatigue, distraction, etc can also apply. Not everyone has the ability to play Cata under idea conditions.[/quote]

Hey, you’re the one that SAID you wanted to eat that active mininuke![/quote]

Uh…my post was saying that sometimes people hit the wrong key, so they didn’t actually want to eat the nuke. ☹

Misfingering should not kill characters, and the “HA HA you hit one wrong button SO DIE AND LOSE ALL THE TIME YOU INVESTED” aspect of roguelikes is a failing, not a feature, IMO.

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**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/cataclysmdda/original/1X/21b5d044e8473b25d0bf905d60477e25f6fbe0cf.png) [@system](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/system)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 3:24am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/15 "2013-06-15T03:24:57Z")

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I see this going horrible wrong if sounds are about and you are reading.

That or it starts raining while you weld and you emo yourself to death.

Or eat that mininuke (active)

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 3:43am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/16 "2013-06-15T03:43:07Z")

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Note that this would cover movement prompts ONLY. Stumbling into dissectors and such.

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**Author:** ![ted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@ted](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/ted)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 4:03am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/17 "2013-06-15T04:03:12Z")

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That’s a shame, because being unable to do activities safely in dangerous environments would actually affect strategy, even if it might be a silly trait if implemented that simply.

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**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/cataclysmdda/original/1X/21b5d044e8473b25d0bf905d60477e25f6fbe0cf.png) [@system](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/system)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 4:04am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/18 "2013-06-15T04:04:22Z")

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I think eating items should damage the player, based on material.

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**Author:** ![Otaku](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/otaku/32/27_2.png) [@Otaku](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Otaku)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 5:49am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/19 "2013-06-15T05:49:31Z")

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> [@Slax](#):
>
> Note that this would cover movement prompts ONLY. Stumbling into dissectors and such.

But what about “(” (I forgot the name of that action, dissasemble?) that also requires a Y/N prompt, would that also be taken away?

> [@gtaguy](#):
>
> I think eating items should damage the player, based on material.

Also, completely irrelevant.

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [June 15, 2013, 6:04am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-fun-trait-careless/1771/20 "2013-06-15T06:04:59Z")

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> [@Otaku](#):
>
> [quote=“Slax, post:16, topic:1771”]Note that this would cover movement prompts ONLY. Stumbling into dissectors and such.

But what about “(” (I forgot the name of that action, dissasemble?) that also requires a Y/N prompt, would that also be taken away?[/quote]  
Up for discussion. I say no though.

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