# New armor screen & changed encumbrance system

**URL:** <https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822>\
**Category:** The Drawing Board\
**Created:** [April 12, 2014, 10:35pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822 "2014-04-12T22:35:36Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![illi-kun](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/illi-kun/32/224_2.png) [@illi-kun](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/illi-kun)\
**Post date:** [April 12, 2014, 10:35pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/1 "2014-04-12T22:35:36Z")

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This discussion has been started in [this PR](https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/7156#issuecomment-40253989).

Folks, what do you think about new UI for advanced armor re-layering window:  
[![](http://s30.postimg.org/tprfszq1t/arm.png)](http://postimage.org/)

Some random details:

- Each clothing/armor covers some layer (underwear/regular layer/over layer/belted layer);
- Manual sorting is possible for items which cover the same part of body and the same layer;
- Extra points of encumbrance appears if the same layer is covered by more than one item.
- Storage points are shown in [brackets];
- Values of encumbrance & storage are removed from description block, environmental protection is added.

Any ideas about these changes? Any weak points of this UI & encumbrance system?

P.S. [![](http://s21.postimg.org/6n1vqgvlz/arm_old.png)](http://postimage.org/)

UPD: [PR with described modifications](https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/7523).

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**Author:** ![Cat09](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/cat09/32/285_2.png) [@Cat09](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Cat09)\
**Post date:** [April 12, 2014, 11:58pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/2 "2014-04-12T23:58:42Z")

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looks pretty nice, not sure exactly how it meshes with other in progress ideas for encumberment changes, however it is waaaay better than the old as far as I can tell

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**Author:** ![kevin.granade](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/kevin.granade/32/1316_2.png) [@kevin.granade](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/kevin.granade)\
**Post date:** [April 13, 2014, 3:32am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/3 "2014-04-13T03:32:04Z")

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The only thing it changes encumbrance-wise is that we assign a “layer” to each type of clothing (we’ve already kind of done this with “tight” clothes). Clothes on the same layer and body part would have the stacking penalty we have now, clothes on different layers wouldn’t interfere with each other.  
A rough cut at the layers:  
Under - Underwear, liners, tshirts, swimsuits. Basically anything intended to be worn under regular clothes.  
Default - everything that doesn’t fall into another category. (this would be the majority of clothes)  
Over - Things intended to be worn over other clothes, like coats, armor, cloaks, etc.  
Belted - Things strapped over clothes like belts, backpacks, holsters.

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**Author:** ![Aluminumfoil](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/aluminumfoil/32/5163_2.png) [@Aluminumfoil](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Aluminumfoil)\
**Post date:** [April 13, 2014, 5:23am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/4 "2014-04-13T05:23:44Z")

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It’s pretty readable and a change like this sounds like a good idea given Kevin’s explanation of the new system (which looks like an improvement to me).

I’m not sure I understand the UI correctly, but if it works like I think it does, I’d suggest using color coded \> marks instead of blank spaces for the various levels, to make it easier to identify the layer at a glance. Like:  
[b]

Torso:

> compression top  
> compression top
> 
> > army jacket
> > 
> > > rain coat
> > > 
> > > > MOLLE pack

> underwear layer
> 
> > regular layer
> > 
> > > over layer
> > > 
> > > > belted layer  
> > > > [/b]

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**Author:** ![Adrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@Adrian](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Adrian)\
**Post date:** [April 13, 2014, 4:06pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/5 "2014-04-13T16:06:31Z")

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Aside from the ghastly font, i like Illi’s new GUI better than the current one.

Also i never understood why we needed the master list of worn clothing on the left, while we have a more easily readable and categorized list on the right.

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**Author:** ![FunsizeNinja123](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/funsizeninja123/32/118_2.png) [@FunsizeNinja123](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/FunsizeNinja123)\
**Post date:** [April 13, 2014, 5:17pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/6 "2014-04-13T17:17:27Z")

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Ikki-kun, the menu maker.

I liek dis.

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**Author:** ![illi-kun](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/illi-kun/32/224_2.png) [@illi-kun](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/illi-kun)\
**Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 7:47am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/7 "2014-04-14T07:47:54Z")

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Adrian, yeah, same thing for me: that’s just wrong to change the order at left and look for results at right.

Aluminumfoil, I think the displaying of the ‘\>’ marks all time can be annoying and can affect readability of clothing names, but color coding of the layers is a nice idea.

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 7:48am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/8 "2014-04-16T07:48:39Z")

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Looks tight. Works for me.

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**Author:** ![Aluminumfoil](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/aluminumfoil/32/5163_2.png) [@Aluminumfoil](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Aluminumfoil)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 9:10am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/9 "2014-04-16T09:10:19Z")

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How does slotless clothing, like jewelry etc, fit into this new scheme?

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**Author:** ![Adrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@Adrian](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Adrian)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 2:21pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/10 "2014-04-16T14:21:52Z")

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> [@Aluminumfoil](#):
>
> How does slotless clothing, like jewelry etc, fit into this new scheme?

Why does slotless clothing exist at all?

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**Author:** ![Slax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/slax/32/5385_2.png) [@Slax](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Slax)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 2:30pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/11 "2014-04-16T14:30:26Z")

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Probably because magic is becoming a thing.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![FunsizeNinja123](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/funsizeninja123/32/118_2.png) [@FunsizeNinja123](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/FunsizeNinja123)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 9:54pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/12 "2014-04-16T21:54:50Z")

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> [@Adrian](#):
>
> Why does slotless clothing exist at all?

Because a necklace would seriously encumber you, right? A watch? A wearable flashlight?

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**Author:** ![Cat09](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/cat09/32/285_2.png) [@Cat09](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Cat09)\
**Post date:** [April 16, 2014, 10:25pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/13 "2014-04-16T22:25:30Z")

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[NOENCUMBER] flag?

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**Author:** ![kevin.granade](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/kevin.granade/32/1316_2.png) [@kevin.granade](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/kevin.granade)\
**Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 2:36am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/14 "2014-04-17T02:36:24Z")

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If it’s not encumbering, why does it need a slot? That’s all slots are for.

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**Author:** ![Adrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@Adrian](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Adrian)\
**Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 6:16pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/15 "2014-04-17T18:16:06Z")

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> [@Kevin Granade](#):
>
> If it’s not encumbering, why does it need a slot? That’s all slots are for.

Wearing 50 rings and 10 necklaces for extreme bling-bonus to conversations.

I know it’s extreme, but that’s the problem i forsee with slotless clothing.

EDIT: Maybe an “accessories” layer?

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**Author:** ![Dominae](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/dominae/32/53_2.png) [@Dominae](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Dominae)\
**Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 6:25pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/16 "2014-04-17T18:25:15Z")

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> [@Adrian](#):
>
> [quote=“Kevin Granade, post:14, topic:5822”]If it’s not encumbering, why does it need a slot? That’s all slots are for.

Wearing 50 rings and 10 necklaces for extreme bling-bonus to conversations.

I know it’s extreme, but that’s the problem i forsee with slotless clothing.

EDIT: Maybe an “accessories” layer?[/quote]

Are YOU gunna tell him he can’t stack like that for the bonuses?

![](http://www.epictoon.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/61597_video-189048-mr-ts-world-of-warcraft.jpg)

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**Author:** ![Aluminumfoil](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/aluminumfoil/32/5163_2.png) [@Aluminumfoil](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Aluminumfoil)\
**Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 8:39pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/17 "2014-04-17T20:39:59Z")

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Fancy items (like jewelry) have no effect on conversations and no effect at all unless you have the Stylish perk, in which case they grant a +1 bonus to morale per item worn. The wiki indicates that some things are +2, but I haven’t seen them yet. The Stylish morale bonus is capped at 20, so by my estimation, BA is wearing three or four items that aren’t giving him any bonuses.

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**Author:** ![Adrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@Adrian](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Adrian)\
**Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 10:08pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/18 "2014-04-17T22:08:33Z")

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I thought the stylish bonuses were going to be applied to conversations with NPCs to make them more friendly and stuff.

Never mind me then 😃

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**Author:** ![illi-kun](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/illi-kun/32/224_2.png) [@illi-kun](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/illi-kun)\
**Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 6:48am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/19 "2014-04-18T06:48:09Z")

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Slotless things can be presented in a separate group (“Other” or something like that).

Another way (probably kind of difficult for understanding by user and more complex than previous option) is to put special field in the JSON definition of the items  
\<num\_before\_enc\>  
and assign the default value of this to 1. It represents the number of items which you can wear without increasing of encumbrance, so for rain coat it’s 1 for sure, but 2 or 3 for tank top, and 5 or even 10 for the rings.

Example of the usage for this \<num\_before\_enc number\>:

CASE 1:  
Char wears the following items on his hands:

- medical gloves (enc: 0, num\_before\_enc number: 1)
- tactical gloves (enc: 0, num\_before\_enc number: 1)
- 3 rings (the same for each ring: enc: 0, num\_before\_enc: 5, assigned to “hands” group, not slotless)

Encumbrance for hands is:

- from items itself: 0 + 0 + 3 x 0 = 0
- from number of items: Round\_Down{(1/1 + 1/1 + 1/5 + 1/5 + 1/5) - 1} = 1
- total: 0 + 1 = 1  
  
 CASE 2, Hands:  
Char wears the following items on his hands:
- medical gloves (enc: 0, num\_before\_enc number: 1)
- tactical gloves (enc: 0, num\_before\_enc number: 1)
- 6 rings (the same for each ring: enc: 0, num\_before\_enc: 5, assigned to “hands” group, not slotless)

Encumbrance for hands is:

- from items itself: 0 + 0 + 6 x 0 = 0
- from number of items: Round\_Down{(1/1 + 1/1 + 6/5) - 1} = 2
- total: 0 + 2 = 2

So, \<num\_before\_enc\> represents the “cost” of each item in terms of encumbrance.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![illi-kun](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/illi-kun/32/224_2.png) [@illi-kun](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/illi-kun)\
**Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 7:21am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822/20 "2014-04-18T07:21:09Z")

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One more thing for discussion: these changes of encumbrance system allow you to avoid the excessive encumbrance easily, so maybe we need to increase penalties for each point of encumbrance?

(Sorry for double-posting but I want to separate these two messages).

[Next page](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/new-armor-screen-changed-encumbrance-system/5822.md?page=2)