Mutation ideas

[Coolthulhu]

[quote=“Valpo, post:33, topic:10651”]Maybe we could put more negative/neutral mutations further down each mutation path so that if you can t find purifier in time you ll also get those sooner or later.

Or add in extra fun into the stonger mutagens. Like dunno random pain, limb damage or halucinations.[/quote]

If anything, it would require making it so that bad mutations happen before the good ones, not after. Canceling only the bad mutations with purifier is one of the problems here.

And adding pain and limb damage to stronger mutagens wouldn’t do anything to address the problem of cherry-picked mutations. You can easily sleep off all of those.
It would require something permanent to work. For example, having stronger mutagens remove good (and sometimes neutral, but never bad) mutations that don’t fit the mutation tree.

[Valpo]

But also survivors would need a reason to try this.
Doing something that will only hurt you won t be done by anyone.

[Coolthulhu]

[quote=“Valpo, post:35, topic:10651”]But also survivors would need a reason to try this.
Doing something that will only hurt you won t be done by anyone.[/quote]

But it shouldn’t be about grinding only the good mutations. That’s tedious, bad for balance and makes mutating without grinding a bad idea.

Instead the mutations should be balanced so that having both the good and the bad ones at the same time should be good enough.

Currently there are some really good mutations, but most are untested.
Mutations that grant vision are great, mutations that cause problems with armoring (or encumbrance) are often really, really bad.
Some mutations could lose the threshold-only status. For example, alcohol metabolism, hibernation, large and infection immune.

[Valpo]

So you want the paths to be balanced befor fiddling with the way survivors mutate?

Well i can definatly see merit in that. A good foundation makes building a house easier.

[Coolthulhu]

So you want the paths to be balanced befor fiddling with the way survivors mutate?

I was talking mostly about the proper way to handle the mutation grind thing.
With robust mutation, mutations are worth it already, even without purifier. Especially when you get night vision upgrades.

Also, current mutation system isn’t exactly tightly balanced. There is no strict balance to keep, so even major changes are unlikely to wreck much.
And if it wrecks mutation cherrypicking, it’s not really a big deal. CBMs are for cherrypicking, mutations are supposed to be chaotic.

Still, some mutations may need adjustment before updating the whole mutation system. I’m talking about bodypart mutations - getting herbivore hurts, but it isn’t game changing at no point, getting webbed hands means you can’t wear hazmat or power armor and any gloves early on.

[Valpo]

Maybe we could inhibit the cherrypicking by restricting mutations to their path . So you can only benefit from the positive mutation from one path. Or perhaps be even more evil and only restrict the good mutations and let the bad one be still “available” from all paths .

[Litppunk]

That just sounds evil enough to kill of the desire for mutations.

[Valpo]

I though of making mutations more like an optional way for early characters to survive. Not some project for when you already have all the means to survive the cataclysm.

[vache]

But why? Seeing as mutagen require lab diving for the mutagen or lab diving and high cooking for crafting, what’s the point in trying to make it an early survival strategy?

[Valpo]

Lab diving isn t that hard. I would argue that if you are carefull its safer then wandering arround in a city.
Also you can find mutagen near dead scientists. So an early survivor might get lucky and have that opertunity.

[kevin.granade]

I though of making mutations more like an optional way for early characters to survive.

They already are, you just have a chance of it hurting you rather than helping, which is the whole point.

[Valpo]

See it like this:

If you take some mutagen you can get lucky n get some good mutations.
If your unlucky you get bad ones.

This can help you early but nobody would lategame use mutagen to increase his survivability.
And its arguebly detrimental to survival if you reach a treshold lategame… except for alpha and medical mutcat.
So theres next to no reason to try and go over tresholds logicaly. I don t mind that so i supose reaching a treshold can stay bad as long as it is part of the risk of taking mutagen.

You take mutagen to better you reflexes get nighvision and increase your balance for example by using feline mutagen.
But unless you have the ressources to stop this mutation you later on get bad mutations like paws.

[Midaychi]

Design the Perfected Insect Serum Solution, do all the refugee center missions and build a ranch-town, convince a whole bunch of refugees of the transhuman insect future and set up an underground cult lab, create new transhuman bug species civilization, become Queen of Survivors. Clearly this is an ending.

[Random_dragon]

…well, time to get a dragonfire mutation. There’s not enough nope in the world for that. ;w;

[Logrin]

Or just wait until sprayable insecticide is a thing…

[ShinQuickMan]

Speaking of a Mutation Nation… What if, instead/in addition to making Slimesprings, post-thresh Slime mutants can create NPC clones of themselves? Totes OP, I know, but with some proper tweaking it just might… nah, I got nothing. I still think it sounds pretty cool, though.

[TheProfileth]

I don’t know if anyone mentioned it, but why doesn’t mutation have a level above transcend? I mean maybe add a chance that when you transcend or maybe after mutating more after transcend you are given a chance to access an even higher level of mutations? Just a thought I was having, maybe we could get some cooler more useful combat oriented mutations that could make it so that you can’t use any body mods where you have the mutations as a way to balance the larger buffs and more interesting play styles opened up by this.

[saltmummy626]

I was thinking about moth mutations the other day. Mostly centered around being light dependent and having scales (the dust on moths wings are scales) that puff off of you under certain circumstances to have some effect on attackers. Also wing spots that scare wild animals. Otherwise, I guess it would just be an offshoot of the insect mutation wouldn’t it?

[Midaychi]

Man, actually altering your anatomy like that in CataDDA would be so incredibly inconvenient. Just look at the huge trait. You’re basically boned when it comes to vehicles. Now imagine that applying to almost every weapon and equipment and useful object and structure in the game. Non-Anthropomorphic Special Needs parking lots.

Basically it’d be like if we figured out how to uplift bears without changing them structurally, and the bears wanted to have a civilization too and do all the cool things. You’d have to re-manufacture everything to be designed for them.

So, posthuman threshold mutations could be neat, but only if CDDA’s crafting system gets a little bit of a revamp. At least needs XL to be a mechanic rather than a preset on recipes.

[Random_dragon]

And now you’re getting to the Fun that is pondering furgonomics. o3o

Enjoy such marvels as how to tailor clothing (or worse, armor) around wings or a tail. Or how to adapt a martial arts style if you have claws (let’s see you make a fist the normal way with those).