# Mutation category expansion

**URL:** <https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755>\
**Category:** The Drawing Board\
**Created:** [November 1, 2013, 4:36am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755 "2013-11-01T04:36:02Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 17\
**Page:** 25

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**Author:** ![Closet\_Pankin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/closet_pankin/32/376_2.png) [@Closet\_Pankin](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Closet_Pankin)\
**Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 7:02pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/481 "2015-01-15T19:02:59Z")

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> [@KA101](#):
>
> [quote=“Logrin, post:464, topic:3755”]I thought raptors had toe talons…wasn’t that in Jurassic Park?

snip[/quote]

Why not make it that with a high enough cooking and other relevant skill, you could design tier two mutagens? Discover and develop them yourselves after your character has become familiar with mutagens. I don’t mean the character design them yourselves, but have a wide range of premade ‘hidden’ mutations that your character can design based on the new world, with more specific and ‘exotic’ mutagens such as salamander, wasp, snake, etc.

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**Author:** ![Closet\_Pankin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/closet_pankin/32/376_2.png) [@Closet\_Pankin](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Closet_Pankin)\
**Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/482 "2015-01-15T19:08:01Z")

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Also, how do shock zombies do mad zaps? Never understood that.

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**Author:** ![Stretop](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/stretop/32/9864_2.png) [@Stretop](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Stretop)\
**Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 7:39pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/483 "2015-01-15T19:39:02Z")

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> [@Closet Pankin](#):
>
> On the topic of mutagen, why wouldn’t zeds work? Or maybe even yourself? 🙂

As far as I understand how XE037 work, zeds would not mutate from mutagens - their mutations are controlled directly by XE037 that animates them. And you yourself are not statistically representative. And since mutagens are probability-based - you would need statistically representative set of test-subjects.

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**Author:** ![Closet\_Pankin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/closet_pankin/32/376_2.png) [@Closet\_Pankin](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Closet_Pankin)\
**Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 8:08pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/484 "2015-01-15T20:08:47Z")

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> [@Stretop](#):
>
> [quote=“Closet Pankin”]On the topic of mutagen, why wouldn’t zeds work? Or maybe even yourself? 🙂

As far as I understand how XE037 work, zeds would not mutate from mutagens - their mutations are controlled directly by XE037 that animates them. And you yourself are not statistically representative. And since mutagens are probability-based - you would need statistically representative set of test-subjects.[/quote]

Hmm… that’s true, I guess.

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**Author:** ![TinHeadDays](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/tinheaddays/32/414_2.png) [@TinHeadDays](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/TinHeadDays)\
**Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 12:44am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/485 "2015-01-16T00:44:09Z")

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Well… I for one, welcome our new lizard overlords.

But on the topic of Tier II Mutations, I actually think it’s a good idea.

Partially because I have no morals.  
But, Tier II should come with a much, much bigger risk, as instead of the usual response (See Below)  
[size=36pt]SUFFER NOT THE TERRIBLE MUTATION[/size]  
and just drink Purifier/Febreeze [size=8pt](I suspect it’s bleach.)[/size]  
Example of Beast Tier I: Beast Mutagen (Tier I) Beast Serum (Tier I Serum)  
Example of Beast Tier II: Beast Stem-Cell Injector (Tier II) Beast Stem-Cell Amplifier (Tier II Serum)

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**Author:** ![EkarusRyndren](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ekarusryndren/32/80_2.png) [@EkarusRyndren](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/EkarusRyndren)\
**Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 5:09am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/486 "2015-01-16T05:09:51Z")

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> [@TinHeadDays](#):
>
> Well… I for one, welcome our new lizard overlords.

I just woke up again. What’d I miss- when’d I get put in charge? …sorta.

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**Author:** ![Muaddib](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/muaddib/32/392_2.png) [@Muaddib](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Muaddib)\
**Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 12:57pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/487 "2015-01-16T12:57:04Z")

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Frankly I’d rather have the devs work on improving mutations and CBM’s in general, and mutation trees that logically flow out of CataDDA’s world instead of someone being all crazy about fantasy animal X.

Why put some salamander or wolf mutant tier II mutation tree in the game when there’s not even a CBM/biomech or nether mutation tree?

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**Author:** ![EkarusRyndren](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ekarusryndren/32/80_2.png) [@EkarusRyndren](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/EkarusRyndren)\
**Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 7:18pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/488 "2015-01-16T19:18:51Z")

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> [@Muaddib](#):
>
> Why put some salamander or wolf mutant tier II mutation tree in the game when there’s not even a CBM/biomech or nether mutation tree?

Well, there’s no CBM mutation tree because… …CBMs aren’t biological. You can’t ‘grow’ a CPU. Sure, there’s biological equivalents, but that’s not a bionic, and that’s not how the goo works.

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**Author:** ![TinHeadDays](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/tinheaddays/32/414_2.png) [@TinHeadDays](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/TinHeadDays)\
**Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 9:24pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/489 "2015-01-16T21:24:52Z")

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The same reason people love Godzilla-He blows shit up.

For example, Have I introduced Bishop Conway Dirvek?  
Yeah. Did we also mention he’s in the Lupinius Mutation Tree?  
GG.

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**Author:** ![EkarusRyndren](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/ekarusryndren/32/80_2.png) [@EkarusRyndren](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/EkarusRyndren)\
**Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:04am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/490 "2015-01-17T01:04:53Z")

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[quote=“TinHeadDays, post:489, topic:3755”]The same reason people love Godzilla-He blows shit up.

For example, Have I introduced Bishop Conway Dirvek?  
Yeah. Did we also mention he’s in the Lupinius Mutation Tree?  
GG.[/quote]

What on earth are you talking about?

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**Author:** ![TinHeadDays](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/tinheaddays/32/414_2.png) [@TinHeadDays](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/TinHeadDays)\
**Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:15am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/491 "2015-01-17T01:15:51Z")

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[quote=“EkarusRyndren, post:490, topic:3755”][quote=“TinHeadDays, post:489, topic:3755”]The same reason people love Godzilla-He blows shit up.

For example, Have I introduced Bishop Conway Dirvek?  
Yeah. Did we also mention he’s in the Lupinius Mutation Tree?  
GG.[/quote]

What on earth are you talking about?[/quote]  
I think I shouldn’t be drinking at this hour.  
I’m actually slightly buzzed, Right now I’m trying to get one of my voice actors TO DO THEIR JOB.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Closet\_Pankin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/closet_pankin/32/376_2.png) [@Closet\_Pankin](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Closet_Pankin)\
**Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 8:52am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/492 "2015-01-17T08:52:30Z")

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…So is anyone still interested in adding in MDD?

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**Author:** ![Flunky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Flunky](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Flunky)\
**Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 9:40pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/493 "2015-01-24T21:40:10Z")

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Regarding all the talk of rare earth metals a couple of pages ago:

Keep in mind that while China is the current dominant producer of REEs it’s not like only China has/produces REEs. For example, the Mountain Pass rare earth mine in CA was the dominant producer in earlier decades. As I understand it there were two major reasons it closed:

1. China flooding the market and driving down prices. In the case of strategic need I doubt this would stop U.S. production (or production in other parts of the world).

2. The environmental impacts. REE mining can create a lot of horribly toxic and/or radioactive tailings. As in some other parts of current industry, not caring about this is one of the reasons China became so dominant. (China’s getting better about environmental concerns now, but it’s a slow process.) Either way, in the dystopian future of CDDA I doubt environmental concerns would block REE mining.

The Mountain Pass mine I mentioned earlier has been started back up in recent years, one of many projects to try and cash in on current demand. While China does still dominate world production there are other sources-- especially if strategic necessity increases (price matters less) and environmental concerns are either mitigated or ignored.

Bottom line, don’t let concerns about REEs overly influence one’s thinking about a fictional future dystopian US government’s ability to produce hypertechnology.

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**Author:** ![AllisonW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@AllisonW](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/AllisonW)\
**Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 9:59pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/494 "2015-01-24T21:59:25Z")

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Another consideration on scarce resources (like REEs, but this also applies to things like food) and the Cataclysm:

In some ways, the Cataclysm can actually reduce scarcity by way of one simple thing: there are fewer people clamoring for scarce resources. Far, far fewer. For all the problems with obtaining certain resources, like environmental dangers, with only a tiny fraction of humanity left to want resources or make an environmental impact, that alone will reduce or eliminate a lot of problems surrounding certain resources today.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Closet\_Pankin](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/closet_pankin/32/376_2.png) [@Closet\_Pankin](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Closet_Pankin)\
**Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 11:01pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/495 "2015-01-24T23:01:49Z")

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[quote=“AllisonW, post:494, topic:3755”]Another consideration on scarce resources (like REEs, but this also applies to things like food) and the Cataclysm:

In some ways, the Cataclysm can actually reduce scarcity by way of one simple thing: there are fewer people clamoring for scarce resources. Far, far fewer. For all the problems with obtaining certain resources, like environmental dangers, with only a tiny fraction of humanity left to want resources or make an environmental impact, that alone will reduce or eliminate a lot of problems surrounding certain resources today.[/quote]

Maybe in the long term, yes. If you’re referring to hunting and foraging, however, you also have to consider the wildlife and that the people who are still there will take a lot more. In the short term, there are many, many people frantically getting supplies. In the three days that you spent in the shelter, the entirety of humanity will be scrambling to get what supplies they can, meaning that what’s left to salvage and scavenge is… not that much.

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**Author:** ![Rhodri](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/rhodri/32/342_2.png) [@Rhodri](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Rhodri)\
**Post date:** [March 25, 2015, 11:11pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/496 "2015-03-25T23:11:27Z")

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The disease/infection immune mutations should act as effective prerequisites to parasite immune, rather than just disease/infection resistant.

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**Author:** ![Codemaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Codemaster](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Codemaster)\
**Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:24am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/mutation-category-expansion/3755/497 "2015-03-27T02:24:01Z")

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Hello this isn’t a mutation category expansion suggestion per say but and idea for mutations. I was wondering if you could make it so that you could make a serum that is late game and doesn’t force you into a category to but lets you chose the mutations you want so for example “If you wanted to have bird wings, full night vision, inferred vision, and like long tail”. You could make it extremely expensive and now thinking it and not wanting to go back and erase the first chunk of typing, require some machine that does a DNA splice that has a risk that is based on how well it was made using construction, mechanics, first aid, and fabrication (possibly, idk). Then how well you program it with your first aid for knowledge of medical stuff and computer for your ability to program the device. Oh also you could as have an input for different drugs such as pain killers and sedatives to help with preventative movement/ pain, antibiotics, royal jelly and an O2 tank to help reduce the chance of death as this is a surgery of sort, so there is always the danger of death.

That way if you want to you can make your character as awesome as you want with the choice of doing it on purpose or not at all to make a god character.

I was having fun with this idea so as I thought that was what was being typed sorry for the bad grammar and lack of proper titles/ names? I’m not sure I made this account yesterday so yeah

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