# Migrating all battery tools to magazine batteries

**URL:** <https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909>\
**Category:** The Drawing Board\
**Created:** [June 23, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909 "2017-06-23T21:07:13Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 10\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![Coolthulhu](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/coolthulhu/32/2446_2.png) [@Coolthulhu](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Coolthulhu)\
**Post date:** [June 23, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/1 "2017-06-23T21:07:13Z")

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In this post I’ll call old batteries, the ones that can be divided and merged freely, “pool batteries” (as in, “battery pool”), and the discrete batteries that have a charge (for example, vehicle batteries) “magazine batteries”.

The vehicle battery compartment mod is supposed to be a step on the eventual migration of all tools to batteries.  
The migration could possibly even happen now, as it isn’t really a new feature, just a json tweak.

We probably don’t want it right now. Mostly because of the stable version being stabilized, but also because of the issues it would cause even if executed with no bugs:

[ul][li]Existing battery migration - loaded tools could just get a battery for free, but there might be edge cases, harder to solve. Piles of pool batteries would need to be converted into piles of magazine batteries in some unspecified way (randomly, based on pool size or something else).[/li]  
[li]Lost granularity - each tool would need to allow only batteries of specific sizes, meaning we’d need “heavy duty batteries” for welders and those batteries would not fit in smaller tools.[/li]  
[li]More keypresses for each reload - you couldn’t just reload with any battery, you’d need to pick one[/li]  
[li]Double battery capacity toolmod gone - would need to be replaced by oversized battery compartment mod[/li]  
[li]Mod compatibility[/li]  
[li]NPC AI would need some fixes[/li]  
[li]Some battery-using recipes would need to be reworked[/li][/ul]

Which ones are MUST FIX before the migration?  
Do we want it fast or do we want it well done? Or maybe not at all?

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**Author:** ![Fris0uman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/fris0uman/32/8607_2.png) [@Fris0uman](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Fris0uman)\
**Post date:** [June 23, 2017, 11:39pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/2 "2017-06-23T23:39:33Z")

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A few questions : - would the magazine batteries be rechargeable or would they just become useless once empty ?

-How many types of batteries would that make ? Small , medium and large (respectively for mp3, flashlight, and welder) ?

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**Author:** ![Rivet](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/rivet/32/11_2.png) [@Rivet](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Rivet)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 12:35am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/3 "2017-06-24T00:35:44Z")

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I like everything about this idea, Coolthulhu.

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**Author:** ![CaioLugia](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/caiolugia/32/120_2.png) [@CaioLugia](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/CaioLugia)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 2:52am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/4 "2017-06-24T02:52:24Z")

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This kind of discussion was taking too long to pop into the forum, actually. Spent a good deal of time wondering how a single unit of a battery pool would work when you added it to a existing pool. Perhaps combining an almost dry battery with a full one, but this is not the case in discussion.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Existing battery migration - loaded tools could just get a battery for free, but there might be edge cases, harder to solve. Piles of pool batteries would need to be converted into piles of magazine batteries in some unspecified way (randomly, based on pool size or something else).

Unless it’s not possible without messing up with the code, it could be based on pool size. Supposedly, 20 or 25 batteries would ‘convert’ to a single AAAA Battery and a 100 batteries pool to a C Battery.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Lost granularity - each tool would need to allow only batteries of specific sizes, meaning we’d need “heavy duty batteries” for welders and those batteries would not fit in smaller tools.

On other hand, one can see this as an opportunity to give actual importance to early-game electronics skills, as there could be crafting recipes of combining different batteries to fit into larger ‘battery sockets’, as well as certain higher difficulty recipes that would allow a “AAA Converted Heavy-Duty Battery”. It could even make do as a extended battery mod.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Double battery capacity toolmod gone - would need to be replaced by oversized battery compartment mod

Partly related to the previous point, although the toolmod recipe could be kept, however, it would instead allow the tool to take D or C batteries.

I can’t think anything about the last three points, because I’m not technically smart to delve into the inner codings of the game involving such mods and the recipes coding. Nor I play with the extremely aggressively and unpredictably natured NPCs to give my opinion.

> [@Fris0uman](#):
>
> A few questions : - would the magazine batteries be rechargeable or would they just become useless once empty ?

Practically used, however, for the sake of balance, they could be still used as crafting components for making concentrated acid. In alternative, there would be common batteries and the rarer rechargeable batteries, which then would be used for more advanced crafting recipes (such as UPSs, CBMs, etc.)

Wish I had the knowledge to mess with the game’s code, would love to work on a idea like this.

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**Author:** ![kevin.granade](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/kevin.granade/32/1316_2.png) [@kevin.granade](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/kevin.granade)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 3:58am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/5 "2017-06-24T03:58:47Z")

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Need some clarification, mainly how many battery sizes are we talking about? I’d guess it’d be something like 2-3 for handheld tools (tiny for watch-sized items, small for flashlights (AA or so?), large for radios or geiger counters (C cells?)), and 1-2 more for large but portable tools (welders, worklights, car chargers).

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Existing battery migration - loaded tools could just get a battery for free, but there might be edge cases, harder to solve. Piles of pool batteries would need to be converted into piles of magazine batteries in some unspecified way (randomly, based on pool size or something else).

I don’t think this is that problematic, loaded batteries ae pretty obvious, piles of batteries can just convert based on some ratio.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Lost granularity - each tool would need to allow only batteries of specific sizes, meaning we’d need “heavy duty batteries” for welders and those batteries would not fit in smaller tools.

This isn’t a problem, this is working as intended.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> More keypresses for each reload - you couldn’t just reload with any battery, you’d need to pick one

I’m guessing you mean based on charge level? Reload should default to the most charged batteries of the correct type with some kind of override in case you want to use less-charged batteries for some reason.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Double battery capacity toolmod gone - would need to be replaced by oversized battery compartment mod

Just a conversion.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Mod compatibility

In-repository mods need to be updated along with everything else, the rest need a conversion guide.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> Which ones are MUST FIX before the migration?

Granularity isn’t acually an issue, NPC handling probably doesn’t work all that well right now, other than those all of them need to be addressed, they’re serious regressions.

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**Author:** ![leebash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/67e7ee/32.png) [@leebash](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/leebash)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 7:22am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/6 "2017-06-24T07:22:40Z")

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It reminds me of a strange problem I encountered before. When I tried to remove a ups compatible mod from a tool, it said ‘can not empty the magazine’ or something like that (I can’t recall clearly). I had to use it up before being able to remove the mod.

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**Author:** ![Coolthulhu](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/coolthulhu/32/2446_2.png) [@Coolthulhu](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Coolthulhu)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 9:29am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/7 "2017-06-24T09:29:13Z")

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> [@Kevin Granade](#):
>
> I’m guessing you mean based on charge level? Reload should default to the most charged batteries of the correct type with some kind of override in case you want to use less-charged batteries for some reason.

Defaults are one thing, but there is a problem of using the much longer magazine reload “routine”: select tool, confirm, pick reload, pick magazine, confirm, select disposal method, confirm.  
Compare to current: pick tool, reload, confirm.

Now that I think about it, it would make perfect sense to allow “swap” disposal method and make it the default option. Say, player reloads with a battery from a charger, the correct option is most likely to drop the old battery in the charger. Player reloads from inventory, so the old battery should probably be placed there.

Additionally, that long mag-reload could be simplified a lot if the last keypress always confirmed the default option, unless there is some other key bound to it. You’d do the default reload like this: select tool, confirm, r, r, r, r, r. Lots of key presses, but not much hand movement.

[quote=“Fris0uman, post:2, topic:13909”]1. would the magazine batteries be rechargeable or would they just become useless once empty ?  
2. How many types of batteries would that make ? Small , medium and large (respectively for mp3, flashlight, and welder) ?[/quote]

1. Probably some rechargeable, other would become scrap for disassembling. The rechargeable ones would most likely have worse capacity and weight, just to make the rest more useful.
2. I’d start with just two: small and large - small for everything that has capacity \<400 right now, large for the rest. Anything above that would require storage batteries and crafted compartments.

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**Author:** ![tarburst98](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/tarburst98/32/1355_2.png) [@tarburst98](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/tarburst98)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 9:59am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/8 "2017-06-24T09:59:25Z")

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ah, after checking there are a few things that would flatout be changed with this, such as the lightstrip, which consumes batteries and needs to be disassembled and then put back together to reload.  
also would this change how regular and the heavy duty flashlight work? the heavy duty holds 200 while the regular can only hold 100. so you ether need more then “400 or 1000” option or one of those would need to be depreciated.

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**Author:** ![TooDAMNMuch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@TooDAMNMuch](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/TooDAMNMuch)\
**Post date:** [June 24, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/9 "2017-06-24T19:29:31Z")

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got a must fix for you, wouldn’t magazine type batteries break battery system CBM, or are we assuming you can vampire the charge out of the magazine somehow?

also, that extra keypress to reload would REALLY suck, some way to keep it still universal at least as far as reloading would be best.

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**Author:** ![kevin.granade](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.cataclysmdda.org/kevin.granade/32/1316_2.png) [@kevin.granade](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/kevin.granade)\
**Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 5:00am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/migrating-all-battery-tools-to-magazine-batteries/13909/10 "2017-06-25T05:00:22Z")

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> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> [quote=“Kevin Granade, post:5, topic:13909”]I’m guessing you mean based on charge level? Reload should default to the most charged batteries of the correct type with some kind of override in case you want to use less-charged batteries for some reason.

Defaults are one thing, but there is a problem of using the much longer magazine reload “routine”: select tool, confirm, pick reload, pick magazine, confirm, select disposal method, confirm.  
Compare to current: pick tool, reload, confirm.[/quote]  
Tools don’t have removable magazines of batteries, so there’s no magazine selection, and as I said, it would default to reloading with the most charged compatible batteries. As for disposal, it would default to placing them in the in the inventory unless that’s full, so by default it’s just pick tool, reload, confirm.

> [@Coolthulhu](#):
>
> [quote=“Fris0uman, post:2, topic:13909”]2. How many types of batteries would that make ? Small , medium and large (respectively for mp3, flashlight, and welder) ?

1. I’d start with just two: small and large - small for everything that has capacity \<400 right now, large for the rest. Anything above that would require storage batteries and crafted compartments.[/quote]  
I’d say three is the minimum, one for very small/portable low current items like flashlights, one for high-current but portable applications like most crafting kits, and one for very high current items like welders. The smaller two really don’t overlap.