Martial Arts Rework

[Logrin]

Basically the idea goes like this:

*Martial arts manuals contain techniques which are learned through study like recipes, using your unarmed skill(or in the case of silat/fencing/eskrima/etc, melee) to determine if you can learn them or not.
*The brawling techniques are picked up from use, as current.
*Choosing a martial art at character creation assumes you’ve had formal study, granting you the knowledge of (But not the ability to yet use) techniques your unarmed skill may be too low to have learned normally.
*Some martial arts (I.E. the assassination arts of the Five Deadly Venoms) don’t have books. You MUST learn them from a teacher.

Now I know at this point some of you may be asking ‘Why bother?’ Simple. A fundamental change to how martial arts work. Currently no matter how many martial arts with which you become familiar it’s an either or scenario, having to choose to use one or another at any given time. Yes, you can switch from karate to kung-fu with but a few key presses–but there isn’t any synergy between the two.

That is why I propose that instead of a menu that has you switch from one martial art to another the player is instead presented with one which lets them edit their personal style from a pool of known techniques. Want an elbow strike with your fencing? Done. Axe kick with that cross counter? No problem. This new model would allow for it.

In a nutshell the player:
*Learns techniques
*Chooses which ones they want to use
*Fights with a customized martial art

As for the actual customization of a martial art, their are a few considerations:
*The more techniques you throw together the more complex your martial art becomes and the higher each techniques REQUIRED UNARMED SKILL WILL RISE!
*Melee techniques (like the ones learned from fencing) demand particular weapons be equipped
*Some techniques, like kicks, knees, on move buffs and krav maga moves should be fine for use with a firearm equipped
*Mutation only techniques could be learned through use and added just like any other to reflect becoming more accustomed to those extra parts. Tentacle-fu, for example.
*Encumbrance should make pulling off techniques more difficult.
*Some techniques could require the player wear specific clothing. Like wearing roller blades for a full speed gut check. (Hockey players start with it)
*Some melee techniques could be learned from using particular weapons instead of being innate to zweihanders or the like. Once learned they can be used with any appropriate melee weapon. No reason a swordsman couldn’t be more defensive if they so choose.
*Special firing techniques could be learned and equipped (requiring certain firearms, of course.) Like trick-shooting or speed loading for revolvers.
*Just off the top of my head, some weapons (like the spear) could have techniques that REQUIRE the weapon be stuck, and of course a technique that makes that happen more often.

So, thoughts?

[Catfoodbob]

Perhaphs some martial techniques you can develope while wearing power armor when active

[kevin.granade]

it’s definitely an interesting idea, and I don’t see any glaring shortcomings (other than how much work to implement, bleh). It dovetails nicely with my desire to make practicing a style into a learning process over time rather than a one off “now you know kung fu” process.
a few tweaks:
The penalty for selecting a lot of techniques should be based on different styles, if you only select techniques from one style there should be no penalty.
Possibly subvert the above by marking some styles as compatible.
Probably an additional bonus of some kind for only having techniques of one style chosen. possibly only triggers once you’ve unlocked and selected all techniques from a style.
Your dominant style (the one with the most techniques selected) would select your stance, which is where the passive bonuses would come from. if your choices are too mixed to have a dominant style, you don’t get passive bonuses.

[Logrin]

Sounds good Kevin, I’ve been wracking my brain trying to think of a good way to keep people from just using all the passive damage increase techniques.

[Wanderer]

I REALLY like this Excellent ideas, i would only add learning through observation, maybe as a Trait, or tied to Perception.

If your character is using a Zweihander in fights and finds another survivor using a Zweihander with techniques he doesn’t know, the less-knowledgeable character should gain more experience through watching to learn such techniques. Nothing like “a technique that i see once is a technique that i know”, of course, and only watching someone doing it would NOT make the character learn it, practical experience is a necessity.

[Flashlight_Hoarder]

Good Idea,Thumbs Up.

[iceball3]

Agreed. This overall seems like a great idea to make martial arts less niche.

[Wanderer]

As it’s written in the C:DDA Design Outline…

“Martial Arts may get Cinematic at the high ends; in particular, the Kung Fu forms will eventually be quest-rewards, and at that point they might permit supernatural effects. Chi and all that. At this point, we’re keeping them tame, because there’s no way to slow or restrict the progression.”

So, we are talking about, exactly? Chinese Martial Art movies, with people flying, fighting in the air, implausible weapons and deadly Chi attacks?

Also, soon or later someone is going to ask, so better soon: Martial Arts and Videogames both lead to Fighting Games, that lead to people shooting energy projectiles from hand. Or foot. Or outside the body, you got it already.

The proposed system would deal with it, and if yes, how? Activable Mutation, learned and equipped as a technique, spending hunger, thirst and stamina to be used, depending of Unarmed Combat(and maybe other stats) for distance, damage, etc? Or technique activated as all the others, that can be used as a ranged shot?

[nickspaceman]

go for it man! it sounds awesome

[KA101]

[quote=“Wanderer, post:8, topic:8683”]As it’s written in the C:DDA Design Outline…

“Martial Arts may get Cinematic at the high ends; in particular, the Kung Fu forms will eventually be quest-rewards, and at that point they might permit supernatural effects. Chi and all that. At this point, we’re keeping them tame, because there’s no way to slow or restrict the progression.”

So, we are talking about, exactly? Chinese Martial Art movies, with people flying, fighting in the air, implausible weapons and deadly Chi attacks?

Also, soon or later someone is going to ask, so better soon: Martial Arts and Videogames both lead to Fighting Games, that lead to people shooting energy projectiles from hand. Or foot. Or outside the body, you got it already.

The proposed system would deal with it, and if yes, how? Activable Mutation, learned and equipped as a technique, spending hunger, thirst and stamina to be used, depending of Unarmed Combat(and maybe other stats) for distance, damage, etc? Or technique activated as all the others, that can be used as a ranged shot?[/quote]

Passive bonuses are more likely: resisting attacks, pain-reduction, that sort of thing.

Flying Fists are less so.

[kevin.granade]

Supernatural/superhuman is a possibility, shooting energy blasts not so much.
A major balance point for that kind of thing is it would only be usable if you’re using just that style, limiting your flexibility.

[Logrin]

I always imagined that movies like THE FIVE DEADLY VENOMS were a good frame of reference for how cinematic Kung-Fu and the Assassination Arts become. No one’s flying or shooting ki at each other, but you’ve got:Ha

Toad: Who’s style lets him break weapons and block spears and knives with his body (Except for that one weak point…)
Lizard: A guy that can climb smooth walls like a gecko
Snake: fights just as well from the ground as his feet and has a deadly ‘fanged’ serpent strike
Centipede: Attacks so fast it’s like he has a hundred limbs
Scorpion: His hands are like bone crushing pincers and his kicks are just as deadly as a scorpion’s sting

Sure. None of them display outright supernatural powers, but almost!

[KA101]

[quote=“Logrin, post:12, topic:8683”]I always imagined that movies like THE FIVE DEADLY VENOMS were a good frame of reference for how cinematic Kung-Fu and the Assassination Arts become. No one’s flying or shooting ki at each other, but you’ve got:Ha

Toad: Who’s style lets him break weapons and block spears and knives with his body (Except for that one weak point…)
Lizard: A guy that can climb smooth walls like a gecko
Snake: fights just as well from the ground as his feet and has a deadly ‘fanged’ serpent strike
Centipede: Attacks so fast it’s like he has a hundred limbs
Scorpion: His hands are like bone crushing pincers and his kicks are just as deadly as a scorpion’s sting

Sure. None of them display outright supernatural powers, but almost![/quote]

And those styles may seem kinda familiar to DDA players…