I want to make a Mutation Mod...and wanted to grab opinions

[psyxypher]

I really want to give back to this game, and Mutations are my favorite aspect of the game, so this is how I plan to give back.

But I want to know what people want out of a Mutation mod. An overhaul of the categories? More mutation categories? Filling in the gaps so Fish doesn’t suck? What about more mutations that aren’t in any categories like Bat Wings (except not useless)? Or maybe some mutations like Metallic Skin?

My one limitation is that I (currently) can’t change anything outside of JSON unless someone tells me how to.

So, what do people want?

[mark]

My broad viewis that mutations are very powerful, but only available very late. There are an enormous number of things in DDA that are very powerful and only available very late; I think the game would be more fun if more options were less powerful and available earlier. Also, most of the power from mutations comes from big stat bonuses, which are boring in an unimaginative way. I am not talking solely about Alpha, although obviously I do not like Alpha at all.

So I would like it if there were mutation categories that didn’t improve stats very much, but were easier to get into. These would have lower skill requirements and more consistent spawning of the recipe books, possibly outside of labs. These less-powerful mutcats could easily exist alongside the current set of mutcats.

One cool thing that would require coding would be more things like rat kings, which can give you directed mutations without you crafting a bunch of mutagens. These could be neat ways for non-mutants to accidentally stumble into mutations they might enjoy, and also make it harder to build a perfect set of mutations and keep it forever. It also gives an in-character motivation to seek out serum-crafting books and cross the threshold, whereas at the moment most of the motivation for mutation is lust for power that you only really know about out-of-character.

[psyxypher]

I dislike enemies that can mutate you, simply because they can completely ruin all of your hard work with no way of you stopping them. The Yugg comes to mind, especially because its darts completely ignore armor for some reason.

I’ve never even considered Alpha. It’s not compatible with StatsThroughSkills. I’ll probably change that.

[Serkas]

How about a bunny/rabid mutation?

I know it sounds silly, but:

• Faster runing/sprinting at the cost of way more stamina.
• better hearing
• ability to jump up a roof (1 story house) to escape
• warm fur, that isn’t heatstroke inducing in summer (maybe loosing hair in spring) and gives you some protection, especially bashing resistance
• bunny vision (actually no idea how good bunnies can see )
• vegetarian food only
• teeth that can gnaw through all soft materials, like a saw or knife could
• powerfull kicks and bites

[psyxypher]

Some ideas I had:

• Get rid of the mutations that are game breakingly bad like Genetic Chaos

• Get rid of diet mutations (IMO, they cause a lot of inconvenience at best)

• To compensate, add more mutations that emphasize the weaknesses of particular trees (such as Trigger Happy on Medical)

• Remove Freakishly Huge and Huge. The loss of vehicle usage is just too big a downside.

• Add more emphasis to each category. Give Fish mutations to make them better in water and also work on the “Shark” angle.

• Make Alpha have altered versions of the Prime mutations that function like their Insane counterparts (and can’t be purified).

• Change some existing mutations altogether (make it so Insect Arms isn’t just for show). Also make Bat Wings into something cool.

• Add more mutations to expand post threshold, especially for the mutations that need it (again, Fish. And Also Lupine and Feline).

• Add new mutations altogether that don’t really exist in nature but are feasible, like Quadra-Hinged Jaws.

[FurryDegenerate]

Remove Freakishly Huge and Huge. The loss of vehicle usage is just too big a downside.

Or make it so that you need a special seat and no roof.
Another thing, does the spider mutation tree turn you into a drider/arachne? If so, other taur-like mutations would be sort of cool.

[Anderson1711]

Some Bioshock style “mutations” would be cool, or Altered Beast transformations from the PS2.

Have the player be able to shoot icicles, flames, bees (projectile) or lightning using stamina or health from certain bodyparts. Or maybe even have some cool powers cause intense pain (plasmids and Altered Beasts’ transformations look painful as hell) to avoid the whole “mana/MP/EVE” concept.

Want flamethrower fingertips? Got it. But it’s going to be painful as hell, crippling even - if used constantly. Have endgame characters need to use morphine to have some neat superpowers (acquired from endgame mutagens, of course)- would also tie-in with requiring injectables to work - from EVE to morphine, lol.

Although I believe that would require some custom LUA.

[psyxypher]

Believe me, I would love, LOVE, to add mutations where you could do stuff like shoot off your claws/fingernails at high speeds as projectiles. The question is how.

Stuff like that is currently beyond my scope of reach, however. Do you have any examples of this being done before, perhaps?

Or make it so that you need a special seat and no roof.

Why you can’t do this already is beyond me.

Another thing, does the spider mutation tree turn you into a drider/arachne? If so, other taur-like mutations would be sort of cool.

I think it’s more having spider legs coming out your back. I’d like to avoid mutations that ruin armor slots unless the characters gets some kind of benefit from it (like highly increased defense, for example).

[Coolthulhu]

Or make it so that you need a special seat and no roof.

Why you can’t do this already is beyond me.

Because no one wrote it.
And no one wrote it because not many people ever get huge.
And not many people get huge because it requires grinding mutagen and also is bad.

If someone found a way to make mutation system work for early game characters (ie. no crafting or lab diving), it would all go much, much faster.

[psyxypher]

IMO, the issue with the mutation system is that it runs you down a long path. Instead of finding some mutagen on a dead scientist and say, using it in a last ditch effort to survive, instead they were supposed to be taken over and over again. This is (supposedly) a gradual process, according to lore.

Not sure how to fix that short of overhauling the whole system, though. My idea would be that instead of running down a path where you mutate gradually, you’d instead undergo a drastic transformation every time you mutate.

As an example, here’s something from the most recent TMNT cartoon. A character, Chris Bradford, was exposed to Mutagen twice, the first time being mixed with an Akitu (for our purposes, the Lupine path).

Human

First Mutation (Dogpound)

Second Mutation (Rahzar)

Something like this, in my mind. That way, finding mutagen on dead scientists becomes potentially helpful instead of a complete crapshoot.

[kevin.granade]

So to put it simply, you’d mutate a dozen or more times for a single dose of mutagen?
That certainly does make things a lot more random, because you can no longer take a single dose at a time and stop when you want.
It’s not too hard to try this out, just add a method that calls iuse::mutate() a semi-random number of times instead of once per dose and assign it to a new mutagen item.

[psyxypher]

Well, after a bit of looking, I can say I’m sure I don’t know how to add a method (as in, where to enter it; in a json in a mod file or elsewhere). But I do want to try this out. If it’s not too much trouble, could you point me in the right direction, please?

EDIT: Completely butchered that. Silly me.

[TheMurderUnicorn]

So I’m new and definitely don’t fully understand mutations, but I’m also a writer that’s full of ideas, so hear me out.

I was thinking that it would be neat to add a survivor class that starts ‘infected’, but not with Cataclysm’s brand of infected. Rather, it would be like Dead Rising 2, requiring the character to constantly require an item (IE: zombrex) to keep them from turning.

I thought this might be implementable using the current mutation system. IE: You begin with the base mutation, which gradually evolves over time. Utilizing the ‘cure’ would remove layers of the mutation, resetting you at the first level. Reaching the final tier would result in your complete zombification, which kills your character.

Is that all possible, programming-wise? Also, is programatically a word, because it’s what I wanted to say there.

So that’s my idea on a mutation mod. Possibly impossible, possibly unwanted.

[psyxypher]

You’re thinking of zombification, not mutation. Zombification happens after a mammal of at least 50 pounds dies, caused by the latent Blob inside the body. Mutation is also caused by the blob, in in a different way. Mutation in life needs energy, provided in either the form of drain on hunger/thirst/stamina, or from radiation affecting the body.

Mutation is generally a good thing if you can control it with the use of mutagens, as it allows you to power up your character. Think of it as an advanced version of the Trait system in character gen. There are negative mutations, however, and different negative mutations limit your character in ways like reduced HP or limiting what clothing you can wear.

[TheMurderUnicorn]

I was more saying that 'Hey I have an idea for a game mechanic and I think it could be implemented through your current system. I wasn’t suggestion that this would be a mutation as mutations currently are, I was more saying that rather than implementing a new system to handle this singular idea, I thought it could be worked to fit into the mutation system. Not as a random mutation, but a specific, narrow path that applies only to these starting characters.

If that all makes sense. It might not.

But if zombification is already in game, then I guess it’s not worth doing.

[FurryDegenerate]

I think it’s more having spider legs coming out your back. I’d like to avoid mutations that ruin armor slots unless the characters gets some kind of benefit from it (like highly increased defense, for example).

I suppose your right, the speed of a horse does not equal being bulletproof unfortunately.
On another hand, a cool idea is a lab finale where you insert the mutagen of your choosing and pick your mutations by hand. It would be like a point system, good mutations costs points while bad mutations give you points. Better/worse mutations would cost/give you more points. For example, the mutagen addiction one and genetic chaos wold get you 5 points while eater of the dead and regeneration would cast 5 points. You can try to get a mutation out of your tree or one over a threshold (When you dont have one yet), but it could cost a lot of mutagen and points or have a high risk of failing (Spontaneous chimera, !FUN!). You also cant get a threshold by using the machine. (This idea came from playing an unhealthy amount of Stellaris)
EDIT: Rambling aside, taur-like mutations would only be for the most dedicated of survivors. For a centaur, you could make some saddle bags and custom armor. You could also move pretty quickly just at a normal pace, but when you run, you are almost uncatchable (Unless NPCs using vehicles will ever happen). It would almost be a second threshold, opening up new mutations like sprinter, making you run faster, or endurance, have massively increased stamina. Connect this with a lance and medieval armor, you are your own knight with a mount. I’m not to sure what would be good additions for a drider/arachne.

I just remembered that horse mutations aren’t really in the game