# I can’t stop having calorie problems, how much do you need?
**URL:** https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180
**Category:** The Bunker
**Created:** [November 6, 2020, 11:10pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180 "2020-11-06T23:10:54Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@spicyshadow](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/spicyshadow)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:50am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/21 "2020-11-07T08:50:15Z")
The activity levels that your character displays are comparable to an anthlete that trains multiple hours a day or a soldier in a active warzone. That you wouldn’t be able to maintain your weight with such a livestyle isn’t surprising at all. Also I think that you just aren’t eating enough lard since when my characters eats nothing but straight lard their calorie intake is consistantly above the 5000+ mark so that should be enough to maintain your weight for your character.
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### Author:  [@BlowedUp](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/BlowedUp)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 9:42am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/22 "2020-11-07T09:42:50Z")
Even your training intensity says that “light” is comparable to walking, it’s ridiculous.
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### Author:  [@Paul\_Blay](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Paul_Blay)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 10:38am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/23 "2020-11-07T10:38:59Z")
Shouldn’t you just get hungry more quickly? If you’re losing weight and you’re not feeling hungry most of the time that seems wrong.
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### Author:  [@spicyshadow](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/spicyshadow)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 11:07am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/24 "2020-11-07T11:07:10Z")
Don’t forget that a good part of your walking will be while carrying a heavy load and possibly over rough terrain so. especially given how inflated carrying capacity is.
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### Author:  [@GiggleGrassGatherer](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/GiggleGrassGatherer)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 12:11pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/25 "2020-11-07T12:11:24Z")
> [@spicyshadow](#):
>
> Don’t forget that a good part of your walking will be while carrying a heavy load and possibly over rough terrain so
So it should depend on those things, not just moderate because reasons.
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### Author:  [@Paul\_Blay](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Paul_Blay)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 12:35pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/26 "2020-11-07T12:35:29Z")
Brisk walk or power walk could be a different, faster, movement setting to ‘walk’.
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### Author:  [@redxlaser15](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/redxlaser15)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 12:41pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/27 "2020-11-07T12:41:24Z")
Well we already have run and crouch as an option so I feel like that would be redundant
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### Author:  [@Paul\_Blay](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Paul_Blay)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 12:52pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/28 "2020-11-07T12:52:35Z")
Well, crouch is obviously a completely different matter.
The question is whether a ‘light’ exercise, low calorie walk is something that needs to exist. The difference between a slow and brisk walk (encumbrance and terrain not considered) is from around 225 to 400 calories per hour. (2mph vs 4mph) If sufficient people are sufficiently annoyed at losing weight I don’t see why it should be ruled out as an option. Especially as it touches on both realism and convenience.
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### Author:  [@Erk](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Erk)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/29 "2020-11-07T17:33:24Z")
Walking is 4 METs. If you look up METs for walking at any meaningful speed, that’s pretty mild. We have named the level for 4 METs “moderate” because it’s the most plain English term for that activity for other stuff that uses it, particularly crafting. We refer to it as a brisk walk because that distinguishes it from a casual stroll. These terms are developer end primarily, don’t worry too much about them.
We do want walking METs to vary depending on speed and carry load and maybe terrain, but that’s a complex change and probably won’t end up reducing the activity level for most players.
The big thing that I think needs changing here is just how we tally activity level. Currently we count every five minute increment as entirely being at the level of whatever highest level activity you were doing, and this makes it so that if you take a few steps during that measured span it counts the whole 5 minutes as moderate exercise. I think we can fix that fairly easily but it’s probably out of my skills so I’m trying to find someone to help with it.
I actually think this has improved a lot. Remember, when we started balancing activity levels, the average calorie expenditure was around 7-12k. We’ve got it down to what military service costs daily, which is well within sanity. There is only a bit of tweaking left to make sure your slow days are actually slow. Bear with us, this is a system with a _lot_ of moving parts.
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### Author:  [@Trigon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Trigon)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 5:50pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/30 "2020-11-07T17:50:42Z")
Ah that’s a good explanation Erk. So even if you spent the other four minutes sitting in an arm chair reading it’ll count as moderate because you took a minute to cross the room and put the book back on a shelf basically. I could see how that could cause some higher calorie burn than expected.
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### Author:  [@Erk](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Erk)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 6:16pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/31 "2020-11-07T18:16:33Z")
The other thing to bear in mind is that the average survivor is walking fairly quickly for six hours a day. At 100 steps/min, that would be around 36000 steps, and I am confident most survivor walking is not at the fairly leisurely 100 steps/min.
We definitely need to adjust the updating, and that will definitely help, but travelling everywhere on foot, fighting zombies, and doing all your work by hand is hard work. The average working class person in a preindustrial country spends around 3500 kcal per day.
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### Author:  [@redxlaser15](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/redxlaser15)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 7:12pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/32 "2020-11-07T19:12:27Z")
Hmm, maybe a slower walk _should_ be implemented then, something between crouching and the normal walk. If you’re not in a rush by any means, you can slow your walk to burn less calories while not going so far as crouching.
Crouching, while slower than walking, very well may count as the same amount of calorie usage due to how you’re moving. It’s closer to a squat which takes a bit more effort, but your comparatively so slow that it’s make it more equal to walking.
A brisk walk would focus on lower calorie usage while crouching would focus on stealth. Brisk walk would be either between a normal walk and crouching or at the same speed as crouching. If you aren’t in a rush by any means, and you want to save on calories, you have a new option.
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### Author:  [@Tazeell](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Tazeell)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 7:22pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/33 "2020-11-07T19:22:52Z")
Thats great and all if what my character was actually doing was comparable to an athlete or active warzone solder. My character spends more time in a chair reading and tailoring than fighting. Still never been able to keep weight. The only time it ever felt like my character calories were right was with very heat dependant when the messages finally went away for while while I read my books and ate high cal items and for once I didn’t have to worry about my weight.
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### Author:  [@redxlaser15](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/redxlaser15)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 7:38pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/34 "2020-11-07T19:38:53Z")
Ya, that’s pretty dang off. If you’re actively moving around a whole bunch killing a bunch of zombies then sure, otherwise seems pretty dang off. Crafting/cooking could potentially be reasonably seen as moderate, but that realistically depends on what you’re doing. Making a strong crossbow would take much more than carving a wooden needle for example.
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### Author:  [@KorGgenT](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/KorGgenT)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 7:43pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/35 "2020-11-07T19:43:34Z")
need to substantiate that claim with a calorie tracker
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### Author:  [@Tazeell](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Tazeell)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:14pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/36 "2020-11-07T20:14:07Z")
Finally managed to deal with some computer problems I was having, still can’t seem to get the launcher working again though. Need to figure out what actually counts for these activities surprised by the results given the crafting binges I’ve been on. Tailoring heavy survivor gear takes forever and a half.
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### Author:  [@Erk](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Erk)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:42pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/37 "2020-11-07T20:42:13Z")
When did you last update? I substantially decreased the activity level of a ton of crafting only a week or two ago.
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### Author:  [@Erk](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Erk)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:45pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/38 "2020-11-07T20:45:24Z")
The micromanagement of adjusting your walk speed when you’re not actively travelling in a hurry or fleeing zombies is unquestionably not worth it for a few kcal savings here and there. Once we stop tracking a single turn of walking as counting for 5 minutes, it will become largely irrelevant.
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### Author:  [@Trigon](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Trigon)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:49pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/39 "2020-11-07T20:49:06Z")
Absolutely. The one second turns would indicate a pretty speedy movement, though I forget exactly how much distance a tile covers.
Second question for me would be to ask about the calorie burn of riding horses or using a bicycle. I feel like bicycles could be less given that one can coast but I’m not sure how CDDA models that
As for horses from personal experience it’s not too bad riding one at a trot, but going at more definitely requires more energy and effort than driving a car, but I’d hardly expect CDDA to be able to model calorie burn based on a mount’s speed.
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### Author:  [@Tazeell](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Tazeell)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2020, 8:51pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/i-can-t-stop-having-calorie-problems-how-much-do-you-need/25180/40 "2020-11-07T20:51:55Z")
With all my trouble I’ve been having with the launcher I haven’t for a week or so. Guess I’ll have to figure out how to update manually.
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