# How come cockroaches ignore zombies? aren't they carrion creatures?
**URL:** https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057
**Category:** The Bunker
**Created:** [March 9, 2021, 5:34am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057 "2021-03-09T05:34:28Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Bio](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Bio)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 5:34am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/1 "2021-03-09T05:34:28Z")
I can understand why zombies might ignore small insects (even though the cockroaches are the size of a dog) but why the heck are cockroaches so viciously aggressive (the fact they’re classified as “minimal” threat is a lie considering how quick they are, can easily cause bleeding, and _always_ travel in swarms) against breathing humans, but completely ignore zombies? Wouldn’t it make more sense for them to try and eat zombies considering they’re carrion creatures?
Either they should be alot more skittish (like cockroaches in real life, especially when exposed to light) to humans (instead of even more bad tempered than moose), or they should try gnawing on zombies. Its not like they’re smart enough to know they’re poisonous, considering how much other literal crap they’ll try and eat…
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### Author:  [@BenJoneWert](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/BenJoneWert)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 6:14am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/2 "2021-03-09T06:14:22Z")
现版本处理僵尸的尸体只有6种方法：
• 酸雨腐蚀
• 火焰燃烧
• 工具回收
• 车辆碾压
• 土地埋葬
• 自然分解
增加第七种方法？
• 动物（昆虫）食用…
我认为除了真实性外并没有任何必要
或许可以大胆的假设，僵尸和变异昆虫已经形成了统一联盟？所以不会“攻击自己人”，即使是尸体，或许会有一个更合理的解释。
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### Author:  [@Venera3](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Venera3)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 6:43am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/3 "2021-03-09T06:43:41Z")
The in-universe explanation is that insects are somewhere on the “blobby” spectrum, the same way still-living humans can be both ferals and normal survivors. The out-of-universe one is we don’t have a faction relation for “ignore until they attack, then engage/flee”, so reciprocal neutrality is the closest we can get at the moment.
Their aggression is a bit overblown, but that’s an easy adjustment for whenever.
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### Author:  [@spicyshadow](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/spicyshadow)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 8:26am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/4 "2021-03-09T08:26:03Z")
Wasn’t becease zombies will ignore any monster under a certain size limit (this is why you don’t see them attacking birds, rats, fish and small mamals anymore) and the cockroaches just happen to fall in that size range. They seem to attack other insects just fine to.
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### Author:  [@Valase](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Valase)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 11:55am UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/5 "2021-03-09T11:55:20Z")
The reason they ignore each other was - as far as I remember from one pull request - that there was too much fighting going on between all the animals and Zombies in a city, so they were made to ignore each other…
Edit:
Well, small correction… I found the pull request and spicyshadow was correct:
> [@Pull request 15372](#):
>
> Zombies don’t want to attack arthropods because those are too small and won’t zombify.
> […]
> Roaches don’t attack zombies because even though they probably could tank that blob poison, they have a lot of better food around.
Also, take a look at this topic, some of the discussion is similar to here:
> [@Cockroach is zombie faction? Intended?](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/cockroach-is-zombie-faction-intended/24538):
>
> What faction is huge cockroach? It is a mutated animal, so I can understand if it in fact zombie faction, but there is no indication that it is, so I thought it was just ‘mutated animal faction’ huge cockroach and zombies go out of their way to ignore each other, even when I went so far as to block a door with the roach, but the zombie just pushed it into the room with me so they could both attack me.
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### Author:  [@Bio](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Bio)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2021, 4:54pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/6 "2021-03-09T16:54:31Z")
I can’t honestly think of what would be “too much infighting” in this game… I’ve seen some pretty messy fights between packs of animals in the woods and zombies
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### Author:  [@DCHY](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DCHY)
#### Post date: [May 8, 2021, 8:45pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/7 "2021-05-08T20:45:15Z")
this may be a bit off topic, but if giant cockroaches were multiplying at the same rate as their smaller brothers in the real world, then I’m sure that in a few years the main danger will not be zombies or mushrooms, but all-consuming swarms of cockroaches. Those cockroaches that we meet in the basement can be either American or brown cockroaches, they multiply quickly, and in truth quickly, but estli to judge by the cockroaches in the game-they are more like Madagascar cockroaches.
madagascar cockroaches are large, have shorter legs, are not super fast and are much less prolific, although these guys are already territorial and protect their offspring, and do not run away in fear when they see you, hence you can take aggression. however, it is precisely the Madagascar cockroaches that do not really like humans as a source of food and at home, they are more fond of forests.
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### Author:  [@DCHY](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DCHY)
#### Post date: [May 8, 2021, 10:54pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/8 "2021-05-08T22:54:15Z")
if you look at the ants, you can understand that the mutation in the cataclysm significantly increases the ability to reproduce, so if this post is read by some bored mod creator, we can get an enemy scarier than a horde of zombies
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### Author:  [@spicyshadow](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/spicyshadow)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 1:32pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/9 "2021-05-09T13:32:47Z")
It seems to do the opposite, the numbers of gaint bugs are much more reduced compared to their smaller counterparts. The number of whasps, bees and ants per colony seems to max out at several dozen to many slightly more than a hunderd for bees and wasps and to several hunderd for gaint ants.
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### Author:  [@DCHY](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DCHY)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/10 "2021-05-09T15:10:42Z")
you meet the queen of ants, you will see that she is able to produce dozens of ants in a matter of minutes, bees and wasps do not have queens in the game, of all this trio, only the queen wasps live for 1 year, bees have only apis, a mutant NPC, Astley, judging by the ants-mutation can significantly accelerate the reproduction rate, so it seems strange to me that cockroaches with their good fertility and survival combined with omnivore almost do not reproduce.
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### Author:  [@Rot](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Rot)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 3:53pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/11 "2021-05-09T15:53:17Z")
I think the lesser ant population would be more to a lack of food and competition rather than the inability to birth many young. It’d also make sense that they could do more work with less colony members.
Even if this is the case, did the cataclysm somehow increase the amount of oxygen in the atmosphere? Or did the blob mutate the insects to have an actual functioning respiratory system like ours in order to facilitate a larger amount of growth?
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### Author:  [@PALU](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/PALU)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 3:59pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/12 "2021-05-09T15:59:50Z")
As far as I understand the blob’s magic compensates for the missing oxygen in giant insects.
I disagree with the statement that cockroaches almost don’t reproduce. Every cockroach killed by my character late in the year (I don’t know when it started, but probably autumn) causes a bunch of nymphs to spray out of the corpse, and there are large amounts of eggs in infested basements.
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### Author:  [@DCHY](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DCHY)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 4:13pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/13 "2021-05-09T16:13:56Z")
eggs? I’m playing on a stable version, however, cockroaches only produce dirt, and pregnant cockroaches spawn nymphs
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### Author:  [@PALU](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/PALU)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 4:29pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/14 "2021-05-09T16:29:51Z")
My experience is with 0.E2 stable (sorry I neglected to mention that). I believe I started encountering roach eggs (together with the dirt that’s “always” has been present) before nymphs starting to appear on roach deaths, but I may be misremembering. The eggs are a pain because they can’t be bashed, so to get rid of them I’ve had to collect them and set them on fire (or run them over with a vehicle).
I think you have to have a reason to look at the dirt (because you’re looking for something to loot) to see the eggs, though.
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### Author:  [@BenJoneWert](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/BenJoneWert)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 5:14pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/15 "2021-05-09T17:14:04Z")
I don’t think the oxygen content in the atmosphere has increased.
In this way, people will have a lot of discomfort symptoms, bronchial asthma and other diseases will be greatly alleviated, which can not be compared with the actual situation in the game.
Supplement:It seems that you and I are not wrong. There are too many opposites in this issue.
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### Author:  [@Rot](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Rot)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 6:08pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/16 "2021-05-09T18:08:14Z")
Higher amounts of oxygen in the atmosphere would explain a lot of things and shenanigans to be honest.
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### Author:  [@DCHY](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/DCHY)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 7:24pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/17 "2021-05-09T19:24:30Z")
I tried again, and you were right. there are cockroach eggs, but eggs are an item, they will never hatch. and pregnant cockroaches are not going to reproduce, only if she dies. while the nymphs are not going to grow up. I’m not sure what I wrote, so maybe I’m wrong.
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### Author:  [@PALU](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/PALU)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/18 "2021-05-09T20:11:13Z")
I haven’t observed any roach eggs hatch, so maybe they won’t, and I haven’t played for long enough to be sure nymphs grow up (but I’ve seen more adults above ground when returning to a city where roaches have been coming out of basements than I would expect, which obviously isn’t conclusive).
@Rot : The oxygen level during the time of the giant insects was about 35% vs 21% today, if I remember correctly. While insects grew to impressive sizes (dragonfly wing spans of half a meter, I think), it still was very far from those of the game. Another effect of a much higher oxygen level (apart from oxygen intoxication) would be a lot more intense fires (and greater ease to start them).
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### Author:  [@Rot](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/Rot)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 8:22pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/19 "2021-05-09T20:22:35Z")
Reminds me of Green Worldz (good manga, you should read it) where the vegetation of the world suddenly skyrocketed and the oxygen levels rose massively. Main antagonists are like plant/human mutant hybrids and giant insects.
In any case, I find it more interesting that you could set up a cockroach farm to generate infinite amounts of food for long-term living just by gaming the system with giant cockroach spawns.
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### Author:  [@spicyshadow](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/u/spicyshadow)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2021, 8:29pm UTC](https://discourse.cataclysmdda.org/t/how-come-cockroaches-ignore-zombies-arent-they-carrion-creatures/26057/20 "2021-05-09T20:29:05Z")
> [@Rot](#):
>
> In any case, I find it more interesting that you could set up a cockroach farm to generate infinite amounts of food for long-term living just by gaming the system with giant cockroach spawns.
Mutant meat form bugs is now poisonous if eaten to much so at most you could suppliment your diet with them. The fat however is perfectly fine to make into biodiesel so they would be a great as a renewable fuel source.
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