Counter vs Counter

[Submarine]

Counter vs counter get you stuck in a loop till one dies. While this happen turns are passing without keypresses. This was with the PK mod enabled.

[techincal]

You should be more specific. How are you even getting counter vs. counter to happen in the first place? Default game nor PK has any melee weapons enabling counter attacks (afaik) and NPCs don’t use martial arts (afaik). Also post your full mod list.

[Submarine]

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/240601510## 6:25:10 second time it happen. Also you are in no posision to demand what I do or not do, be happy I take the time to report it.

[FurryDegenerate]

He’s only trying to help, there is no need to be aggressive. Any help with finding bugs in the game are useful to make sure they will be fixed. It would be useful if you described what happened as precisely as you can plus what version you are using plus what mods you are using. If English is not your first language, try the best you can or if particularly suck at it, you could post in your native language and we could translate it for you.

[Vormithrax]

Hi folks, here are some more details. It happened during my Live-stream last night.

You can see the original issue in action at 6:14:30 in this episode: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/240601510

The problem occurred when my Blackbelt profession with the Zui-Quan fighting style stepped next to some Giant Cellar Spiders. Some kind of loop started (we suspect due to conflicting/infinite dodge/counter-attacks) and turns were passing without any key presses by me, quickly resulting in my death.

I don’t think it is related to anything in PK’s as i just created a quick test world with fairly vanilla mod’s ( i can provide a list if necessary but it did NOT include PK) where i created a generic Blackbelt with Zui-Quan, i summoned 6 cellar spiders and when i stepped next to them the same kind of loop started. In this test it crashed my Cataclysm client before i died.

Give it a try and let me know if any further details are needed to reproduce it.

My stream and test were on Experimental Build 7218, Zui-Quan fighting style from Blackbelt profession, standing next to a few Giant Cellar Spiders.

[Coolthulhu]

My fault.
How do we want the counters? Free in move cost? Applying some debuff to counterer? Free-but-requiring-something?

[Submarine]

Free in move cost as the description already said? Or maybe some stamina loss to make it less exploiteble but that can you stil get stuck in somekind of loop in extreme situations. Safest bet I think is as soon you do a succesfull counter the attacker lose all action points for that turn.

@FurryDegenerate Yes my English is bad but I still see his reply is blunt, you calling me aggressive I dont like either.

[NFossil]

Wow.

Your English must be really bad to see that as any sort of aggressive or even “blunt”. It is merely typical for people to state the best way of reporting mistakes. No. People should not be happy that you take the time to report it. People should be correctly annoyed with vague and unhelpful reports taking up the forum space.

Now THIS is aggressive and blunt.

[Submarine]

Dont worry Im done posting bugs. Counter isnt working as is documented , that alone should give enougf info for the people that worked on it I figured. On top of that I reported it first on that discord kinda channel you guys have and there I been told it was a old issue.

[Litppunk]

And US has budget balancing problems, I don’t see the results I expected from >insert president here’s plan< I expect solution now. What is it?

• Code is complex layering of very basic inputs and outputs, among other things finding and fixing specific problems requires tracking down exactly what input/output sequence having a problem so error can be tracked down and fixed, the more detail that is submitted the easier it is for the troubleshooters to track down the specific bit that is causing things to go awry. Being given very vague and simple alert of a problem existing is almost useless, posibly more than useless and so creates agrivation in the coders you are expecting to ‘wave a magic wand’ and solve the problem.

TL;DR: Knowing WHAT the problem is, is a great asset in solving it.

[Submarine]

Read my first post… COUNTER … PASSING TURNS…There, I found you the problem.

[psyxypher]

I see the problem here:

Counter takes up time in game, which can cause “Counter-Locks” between an enemy attacking an a character countering. In the time it takes someone to counter, the critter they are countering against attacks again, and then causes the person to counter, again. Thus, Counter Lock.

Someone on the Reddit had this issue before. .

With Bionic Combatives, I don’t remember a Counter-Attack actually taking up any time…is this something that only the other Martial Arts do?

[Litppunk]

Military ‘costs too much’ found the problem now solve with magic wand.

@submarine treating trolls as legitimate is such a great mental excersice, thinking things through from the ground up and seeing what perspective you come too, and if its different from your original
hmm… kinda getting lazy though

ok, thanks psyxpher
Knowing what things specifically are in play helps.

Which Martial arts do you have, that have Counter-Attack?, What creatures are you fighting that also have counter attack, it could be on either side, or a combo bug.
That said, Im not a coder, and havn’t “dived” in CDDA, I’ve yet to even get a character past the first week or so, so Here’s a summary of what I’ve noted thus far for those that have:

Code Complications

Experimental 7218

Potential Contributers

• Martial Arts -
  Dragon Style
  Zui-Quan

• Opponents -
  Sludge Crawler
  Giant Cell spider

Looks like its player side, and counterattacks are eating up players turn and locking them into defending themselves for infinite rounds until they are dead due to occasional hits, or even starvation. Sounds like its a fairly recent edit regarding how countering effects players turn.

[Submarine]

Can you plse stop with your insults? I am a novice cata player who does watch DDA on Twitch. I have no background in coding what so ever. All I want is a better CDDA.

Ty.

Does a Zombi Wrestler fits the bill too?

[Litppunk]

not making fun of you. Im stating that I have no relevant code experience, and putting all the relavent items in a list for those that do, as an example for how to do it in the future. Sorry if my similar situation made you think I was making fun of you. I have a pretty overly optimistic view of things and sometimes it comes off as sarcastic.

Better details of bugs instead of getting annoyed at those trying to gather info so they can fix them is a good way to improve CDDA

Hmm, sounds like it would basically be a brute grabber, not sure how well that would work, except maybe late game. Would have to be carefull not to make it to powerful or youd wind up with too many players gettting in a similar situation as the counter-counter loop, but with the grabbing zombie and trying to break free. Which would kind of be the point of such a zombie, so it would have to come late enough in zom evolution line to be a valid increase in difficulty.

[Submarine]

I asked if a Zombi Wresler also can lock you in the same loop as Giant Cell spider does? Would be nice to know what enemys to avoid for now.

[Litppunk]

I don’t know, I don’t play enough

[syler1983]

What about some sort of cooldown which prevents a creature (and a player) from countering more than ones per turn?
Or just forbid to counter counter?

@litppunk, i think you’re exaggerating. Probably devs need a few examples of the bug and description of the bug mechanics but not the full (and exaggerated) list of all entities relevant to the bug.

PS: I thought this was a fresh post, didn’t looked at dates.

[Litppunk]

probably, but by exagerating and going into extended details, I thought it through more, which is a nice exercise for me as well, and is a preferable alternative to - there is a problem, fix it jerks.